Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Post by Peter Chil » Sat, 08 Jan 2000 04:00:00



The standard FP search form starts with the following statements - - -

"Comment: Text Search - This page lets you search through the default
text index that is created whenever web pages are saved or web links are
recalculated. No customization is required.

Use the form below to search for documents in this web containing
specific words or combinations of words. The text search engine will
display a weighted list of matching documents, with better matches shown
first. Each list item is a link to a matching document; if the document
has a title it will be shown, otherwise only the document's file name is
displayed."

It goes on to say that it allows the use of AND, OR and NOT () and * as
a wildcard after one or more letters.

So far so good!

(In case it's relevant, I'm using FP97 and FP2000 Premium)

1. My ISP reports that my searches using this search form method are NOT
confined to the directories/folders containing my web pages. In other
words, it's searching for documents *outside* of "this web containing
specific words or combinations of words" (as quoted above).

The ISP cannot find a way of restricting the search to the area intended
so that I've had to remove the search facility until a solution is
found.

The search form properties mentions "Word list to be search" which seems
to default to "all". Is this the clue? What should be entered in this
box?

2. How should the weighting indicated on the weighted list be
interpreted? Anything more than "with better matches shown first"?

Maybe I've answered my own question because I've just conducted an
experiment. I formed two files, both containing *only* the characters

xyz

(and these being the only files in my web containing xyz) and saved them
in my web.

If I search for xyz the two files are identified with scores of 707
If I search for xyz* the two files are identified but with a score 1414

Exactly the same scores respectively appear if the two files contain xy
and xy* respectively.

These scores are highly reminiscent of the reciprocal of the square root
of 2, and the square root of two, respectively, but three orders of
magnitude larger.

Any ideas anyone? It would have been a lot simpler if the score had been
a count of the occurrences of the text being sought!

I'm now more curious than ever to understand the strange results I've
obtained.

3. Is there any way of making it search for a string of words?
A common enough search when looking for someone, such as    Mr Paul
Smith

Searching for (Mr AND Paul AND Smith) does not produce the required
result.

4. How can I format the items that appear as results? eg. Size, bold,
italic, colour, make the table have zero borders, etc . .

5. Rather more generally, where can I find the definitions of all/many
of the webbots - and IMPORTANTLY, a list of their variable parameters
and their functions? I've asked this question before but even an MVP
didn't seem to understand what I thought was a reasonable question.

--
Best regards
Peter Child

 
 
 

Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Post by Tom Peppe » Sat, 08 Jan 2000 04:00:00


It's because your host has index server running and a catalog needs to be
specificlly built for your site, and they must do it, or turn off index
server.  Ask them if they've read the documentation that comes with the
operating system they host you on.

--

Tom Pepper
Web Mangler & Cantankerous Old Grump
Sharp Communication, Inc. - Huntsville, Alabama
--


>The standard FP search form starts with the following statements - - -

>"Comment: Text Search - This page lets you search through the default
>text index that is created whenever web pages are saved or web links are
>recalculated. No customization is required.

>Use the form below to search for documents in this web containing
>specific words or combinations of words. The text search engine will
>display a weighted list of matching documents, with better matches shown
>first. Each list item is a link to a matching document; if the document
>has a title it will be shown, otherwise only the document's file name is
>displayed."

>It goes on to say that it allows the use of AND, OR and NOT () and * as
>a wildcard after one or more letters.

>So far so good!

>(In case it's relevant, I'm using FP97 and FP2000 Premium)

>1. My ISP reports that my searches using this search form method are NOT
>confined to the directories/folders containing my web pages. In other
>words, it's searching for documents *outside* of "this web containing
>specific words or combinations of words" (as quoted above).

>The ISP cannot find a way of restricting the search to the area intended
>so that I've had to remove the search facility until a solution is
>found.

>The search form properties mentions "Word list to be search" which seems
>to default to "all". Is this the clue? What should be entered in this
>box?

>2. How should the weighting indicated on the weighted list be
>interpreted? Anything more than "with better matches shown first"?

>Maybe I've answered my own question because I've just conducted an
>experiment. I formed two files, both containing *only* the characters

>xyz

>(and these being the only files in my web containing xyz) and saved them
>in my web.

>If I search for xyz the two files are identified with scores of 707
>If I search for xyz* the two files are identified but with a score 1414

>Exactly the same scores respectively appear if the two files contain xy
>and xy* respectively.

>These scores are highly reminiscent of the reciprocal of the square root
>of 2, and the square root of two, respectively, but three orders of
>magnitude larger.

>Any ideas anyone? It would have been a lot simpler if the score had been
>a count of the occurrences of the text being sought!

>I'm now more curious than ever to understand the strange results I've
>obtained.

>3. Is there any way of making it search for a string of words?
>A common enough search when looking for someone, such as    Mr Paul
>Smith

>Searching for (Mr AND Paul AND Smith) does not produce the required
>result.

>4. How can I format the items that appear as results? eg. Size, bold,
>italic, colour, make the table have zero borders, etc . .

>5. Rather more generally, where can I find the definitions of all/many
>of the webbots - and IMPORTANTLY, a list of their variable parameters
>and their functions? I've asked this question before but even an MVP
>didn't seem to understand what I thought was a reasonable question.

>--
>Best regards
>Peter Child


 
 
 

Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Post by Thomas A. Row » Sat, 08 Jan 2000 04:00:00


First, if your site is hosted on NT and is return search results from other
webs on the server, then the host has Index Server running. To limit the
search to your web, the host needs to build an Index Catalog for your web.

To learn more about Index Server, check out the Microsoft NT Server site, to
learn more about the standard FP search function, search the Microsoft
Knowledge Base on WAIS search engine.

There is not documentation available outside the components properties
dialog, the help file or what can be found in the MS KB pertaining to the
use of the varies FP components, as far as I am aware.

--
=====================================
Thomas A. Rowe (Microsoft MVP - FrontPage)
WEBMASTER Resources(tm)
http://www.ycoln-resources.com
FrontPage Resources, Email Discussion List,
Newsletter, WebRing, MS KB Quick Links, etc.


Quote:> The standard FP search form starts with the following statements - - -

> "Comment: Text Search - This page lets you search through the default
> text index that is created whenever web pages are saved or web links are
> recalculated. No customization is required.

> Use the form below to search for documents in this web containing
> specific words or combinations of words. The text search engine will
> display a weighted list of matching documents, with better matches shown
> first. Each list item is a link to a matching document; if the document
> has a title it will be shown, otherwise only the document's file name is
> displayed."

> It goes on to say that it allows the use of AND, OR and NOT () and * as
> a wildcard after one or more letters.

> So far so good!

> (In case it's relevant, I'm using FP97 and FP2000 Premium)

> 1. My ISP reports that my searches using this search form method are NOT
> confined to the directories/folders containing my web pages. In other
> words, it's searching for documents *outside* of "this web containing
> specific words or combinations of words" (as quoted above).

> The ISP cannot find a way of restricting the search to the area intended
> so that I've had to remove the search facility until a solution is
> found.

> The search form properties mentions "Word list to be search" which seems
> to default to "all". Is this the clue? What should be entered in this
> box?

> 2. How should the weighting indicated on the weighted list be
> interpreted? Anything more than "with better matches shown first"?

> Maybe I've answered my own question because I've just conducted an
> experiment. I formed two files, both containing *only* the characters

> xyz

> (and these being the only files in my web containing xyz) and saved them
> in my web.

> If I search for xyz the two files are identified with scores of 707
> If I search for xyz* the two files are identified but with a score 1414

> Exactly the same scores respectively appear if the two files contain xy
> and xy* respectively.

> These scores are highly reminiscent of the reciprocal of the square root
> of 2, and the square root of two, respectively, but three orders of
> magnitude larger.

> Any ideas anyone? It would have been a lot simpler if the score had been
> a count of the occurrences of the text being sought!

> I'm now more curious than ever to understand the strange results I've
> obtained.

> 3. Is there any way of making it search for a string of words?
> A common enough search when looking for someone, such as    Mr Paul
> Smith

> Searching for (Mr AND Paul AND Smith) does not produce the required
> result.

> 4. How can I format the items that appear as results? eg. Size, bold,
> italic, colour, make the table have zero borders, etc . .

> 5. Rather more generally, where can I find the definitions of all/many
> of the webbots - and IMPORTANTLY, a list of their variable parameters
> and their functions? I've asked this question before but even an MVP
> didn't seem to understand what I thought was a reasonable question.

> --
> Best regards
> Peter Child

 
 
 

Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Post by L.J. » Sat, 08 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Hi:

I'm a bit confused that you're using two versions of Frontpage, however...

Quote:> 1. My ISP reports that my searches using this search form method are NOT
> confined to the directories/folders containing my web pages. In other
> words, it's searching for documents *outside* of "this web containing
> specific words or combinations of words" (as quoted above).

Your ISP cannot have his server setup properly.  You have a frontpage web.
The search component searches for pages in that web.  If it's somehow
searching outside that scope, then your ISP must surely have all kinds of
security problems (apart from a badly configured server).

Quote:> 4. How can I format the items that appear as results? eg. Size, bold,
> italic, colour, make the table have zero borders, etc . .

You would have to use a style sheet.  You cannot remove the table.  You
cannot change the way the information is output from the server.

Quote:> 5. Rather more generally, where can I find the definitions of all/many
> of the webbots - and IMPORTANTLY, a list of their variable parameters
> and their functions? I've asked this question before but even an MVP
> didn't seem to understand what I thought was a reasonable question.

Did you ask in this NG?  I'm surprised because the MVP's here are the best!
[crawl, crawl].  You should take a look at the SDK and programming notes.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/techart/fpothres.htm

Follow the link to the SDK.

--
Cheers: L.J.

I will make you shorter by a head.
Elizabeth I (1533-1603)

http://www.strictlybritish.co.uk - Banish British Beef to email me.


Quote:> 4. How can I format the items that appear as results? eg. Size, bold,
> italic, colour, make the table have zero borders, etc . .

> 5. Rather more generally, where can I find the definitions of all/many
> of the webbots - and IMPORTANTLY, a list of their variable parameters
> and their functions? I've asked this question before but even an MVP
> didn't seem to understand what I thought was a reasonable question.

> --
> Best regards
> Peter Child

 
 
 

Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Post by Peter Chil » Sat, 08 Jan 2000 04:00:00



itishbeef.net> writes
Quote:>Hi:

>I'm a bit confused that you're using two versions of Frontpage, however...

What I guess I meant was  . . . .  I was using FP 97 and now I've gone
on to FP2000 but have the same problem . . .

--
Best regards
Peter Child

 
 
 

Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Post by Peter Chil » Sat, 08 Jan 2000 04:00:00




Quote:>It's because your host has index server running and a catalog needs to be
>specificlly built for your site, and they must do it, or turn off index
>server.  Ask them if they've read the documentation that comes with the
>operating system they host you on.

Thanks - I'll get on to them tomorrow.

--
Best regards
Peter Child

 
 
 

Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Post by Peter Chil » Sat, 08 Jan 2000 04:00:00




Quote:>First, if your site is hosted on NT and is return search results from other
>webs on the server, then the host has Index Server running. To limit the
>search to your web, the host needs to build an Index Catalog for your web.

>To learn more about Index Server, check out the Microsoft NT Server site, to
>learn more about the standard FP search function, search the Microsoft
>Knowledge Base on WAIS search engine.

>There is not documentation available outside the components properties
>dialog, the help file or what can be found in the MS KB pertaining to the
>use of the varies FP components, as far as I am aware.

Thanks. I'll pass this on to my ISP tomorrow.

--
Best regards
Peter Child

 
 
 

Help - please! Problem with search forms in FP

Post by L.J. » Sun, 09 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Read Tom & Thomas' posts.  My assumption was incorrect.  It's an Index
Server issue.

--
Cheers: L.J.

I will make you shorter by a head.
Elizabeth I (1533-1603)

http://www.strictlybritish.co.uk - Banish British Beef to email me.



> itishbeef.net> writes
> >Hi:

> >I'm a bit confused that you're using two versions of Frontpage,
however...
> What I guess I meant was  . . . .  I was using FP 97 and now I've gone
> on to FP2000 but have the same problem . . .

> --
> Best regards
> Peter Child

 
 
 

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