Very Computer

I  installed  Tornado 1.0.1  ( 80x86)  for  Windows on 3 PC:
2 NT 4.0 Workstation and a Win98 laptop;

It is about 10 days I am trying to make them work but I am only experimentig
that one installation on WinNT4.0 is working at 60%, another one on  WinNT
4.0  too ( with SP3 )  is absolutly not working. ( installed from the same
CD on an twin machine ( the only difference is that one machine has 2 NTFS
partitions while the other one has 1 FAT16 and 1 NTFS ).
The Win98 version is at the moment the only one that let me compile vxWorks
kernel,
Yesterday I installed the licence manager 3 times on an NT4.0 Server and, at
last, after 2 reboots  has started working.
At the moment the licence manager is THE ONLY THING THAT WORKS PROPERLY ....
I have the feeling ( and something more really )  that this development
system is a true "banana".

I only hope that vxWorks operating system may work much better than its
development system.

Does anyone experimented a similar case ?

Wolfy

Geez, I dunna.  Besides the fact that the installation process
is a little clumsy, we didn't have much trouble getting it set
up (on HP-UX, on Win95, on WinNT workstation, on Solaris).
What troubles are you experiencing?  

Some tips:

If you're using a pre-Windview 2.0 (ZC-10) CD-ROM (at least for
PPC target), always install SENS after everything else.

Be careful to install with the license server set up correctly
(that is, floating if it is floating, etc.).  

You probably need to install the Portmapper.

Make sure the registry and license servers are running where
you've told the installations they are running; you can check
under Programs->Tornado->Registry&License

NOTE:
You'll still need to reboot occasionally, but typically not
directly due to Tornado.

--
Tim Sohacki, Nortel Networks, Inc.

writes

Quote:>I  installed  Tornado 1.0.1  ( 80x86)  for  Windows on 3 PC:
>2 NT 4.0 Workstation and a Win98 laptop;

>It is about 10 days I am trying to make them work but I am only experimentig
>that one installation on WinNT4.0 is working at 60%, another one on  WinNT
>4.0  too ( with SP3 )  is absolutly not working. ( installed from the same
>CD on an twin machine ( the only difference is that one machine has 2 NTFS
>partitions while the other one has 1 FAT16 and 1 NTFS ).
>The Win98 version is at the moment the only one that let me compile vxWorks
>kernel,
>Yesterday I installed the licence manager 3 times on an NT4.0 Server and, at
>last, after 2 reboots  has started working.
>At the moment the licence manager is THE ONLY THING THAT WORKS PROPERLY ....
>I have the feeling ( and something more really )  that this development
>system is a true "banana".

It is fair to say that WRS seem to care more about getting the
licensing working than they care about the product.

Make sure that you have the patch installed :  when you
start the Tornado environment pull down the help dialog
box and look at the version details.  There should be an
entry there for something like "cumulative patch x86".  
Tornado is not really usable without it so be warned.

Quote:>I only hope that vxWorks operating system may work much better than its
>development system.

It does. It would have to in order to be useful :-)

--
Mike Davies

I spent the best part of yesterday getting Tornado 1.0.1 running on my
new laptop.  It is all up and running but I'm really getting fed up
with their paranoid copy protection BS.  I have wasted countless hours
because of license keys.  I have to get a new one everytime I change
locations, which is often.  Then, I had to get special permission from
our sales rep to transfer my licenses from my desktop to my new
laptop.

The entire problem is the license and copy protection stuff, and if
Wind River doesn't get it out of there, CE is going to eat their
lunch.

Bruce Wedding
Software Manager

Scientific MicroSystems, Inc.
http://www.scimisys.com
Tomball, Texas

Hmm, I don't see that on mine. Where is it exactly?

OK, on Tornado 1.01 targeted for the 80x86 there is a standard
looking help menu with an "about" item that displays a dialog
box.  This dialog box has a button that displays the Tornado
SW version and configuration details in a list box. (I'm at
home and I can't remember the button's name, sorry).

If you apply the patch after installing Tornado then the first
item in the list box will be words to the effect of "cumulative
patch x86" or something similar.

If it doesn't say this then you don't have the patch.  And
Tornado, compiler and all is bugged beyond use.  

Why didn't your WRS representative explain this to you ?  I'd
ask them, con brio.

Regards,

--
Mike Davies

We definately have nothing like this!
Does it only apply when your target is x86?
We are using NT as host but our target is sh3.

Our experience of WindRiver support has been laughable.
We usually fix problems that we report before they do!
The only thing they fixed was when the clocks went back and the license
server stopped 'serving licenses'.

Quote:>We definately have nothing like this!
>Does it only apply when your target is x86?

Sorry, I don't know - I've only used the x86 target.

Quote:>We are using NT as host but our target is sh3.

>Our experience of WindRiver support has been laughable.
>We usually fix problems that we report before they do!
>The only thing they fixed was when the clocks went back and the license
>server stopped 'serving licenses'.

That's them OK :-)  Get the licences sorted and who gives a
* about the product ?

I made a caustic remark about the quality of WRS's support
to an experienced colleague when I first started using
VxWorks , his jaundiced reply was :

"You mean they didn't get back to you to tell you they didn't
know how to fix it ?"

This an exact description of WRS support.  What are they playing
at ?  When they next answer the phone say the word "sourceware"
then carry on without making any other reference to it |-)

Good Luck,

--
Mike Davies

Like they say, most of what you find on the internet is junk, this included.

Well congratulations on this significant expose! Interestingly it is a
mandatory patch so that must mean it's carefully concealed. But no, there it
is in plain view on their web site! Just after a maintenance release and ahead
of the daylight saving patch.

The cumulative patch is to be applied to old installations and does not apply
to all architectures. ARM and ColdFire post date the cumulative patch for
example. Later installations apply the patch automatically.

To quote the web site (which you both have access to since you are *ing
about support):-

NOTE: Depending on how recently you received and installed Wind River
products from the Tornado CD-ROM, you may already have installed the
cumulative patch.  You can verify this by examining the file called
setup.log at the root of the directory specified by the WIND_BASE
environment variable.

I hope that clears up your confusion.

JRC

Quote:>Like they say, most of what you find on the internet is junk, this included.

>Well congratulations on this significant expose! Interestingly it is a
>mandatory patch so that must mean it's carefully concealed. But no, there it
>is in plain view on their web site! Just after a maintenance release and ahead
>of the daylight saving patch.

Well, actually John, my remark was about why WRS support hadn't
mentioned it.  They didn't mention it to me for a prolonged
period when I was having problems either.

Quote:>The cumulative patch is to be applied to old installations and does not apply
>to all architectures. ARM and ColdFire post date the cumulative patch for
>example. Later installations apply the patch automatically.

Then it either doesn't apply to the posters's target, or else
he's been provided with a non-"Later installation".

My reason for telling him about it was that nobody at WRS told
me about the patch (which has had some positive impact on the
Tornado BSOD problem under NT) - my assumption was that the same
misfortune had befallen him.  If support from WRS was better
then I guess he'd have had other places to ask for help, hmm ?

Quote:

>To quote the web site (which you both have access to since you are *ing
>about support):-

LOL :-)

Well, I thought I'd check the web site to see if I could find
this patch.  When I did then all the reasons I don't make use
of WRS online support came back to me :

1       I went to "http://www.veryComputer.com/"
        There's something fishey about this site so I thought
        I'd try .com instead :-)

2       "http://www.veryComputer.com/" - This may not be WRS's fault
        but from the UK this afternoon it was painfully slow :-/

3       Oh yes, I remember now, you need a password to get onto
        the support pages.  What did I use last time ?
        Oh ! It doesn't work any more :-/

3       Let's try to obtain a new user ID for Windsurf.
        Of course it wants my product licence number !
        (well I suppose that's common for a support web
        page)

4       Back to Outlook for the licence number (mailed
        to me at the end of Jan this year and valid from
        Jan 26 1999 without an expiry date)

5       Type in the licence number.
        "Your Licence has expired".  :-/ :-/ :-/

6       "Fill in your details for ..."
        followed by a form with around 40 fields.

7       As so often before using WRS support my preferred
        option was :
        "It'll be quicker just not to bother"

8       Got on with what I'm paid for muttering under my
        breath about WRS support.

9       The colleague I quoted before ("You mean they didn't
        get back to you to tell you they didn't know how to
        fix it ?") offered this remark :

        "... typical ..."

Which it is.

You've accused me of *ing and I object to that.  If WRS looked
at customer support as less of a nuisance and more as being their
bread and butter (and jam, given the price) then people would
complain about it less.  The products WRS sell are not cheap, and
the support has been of a lower quality than I have been used to.

Your response also highlights the nature of the problem at WRS :

They care about the licensing, not about the customers' problems.

I make the assumption that you work for WRS though you don't say
so.  If you ignore customer complaints ("*ing") then you
won't solve the problems.  I was trying to help a fellow user
who was proclaiming difficulties in a public forum.

No-one from WRS offered to step in instead.

Typical.

--
Mike Davies

Is your maintenance up to date?

Quote:> Our experience of WindRiver support has been laughable.
> We usually fix problems that we report before they do!
> The only thing they fixed was when the clocks went back and the license
> server stopped 'serving licenses'.

I don't want to start a polemic thread there, but i have to say the
support on UNIX is at least as bad as on Windows : if you call a support,
he will usally begin with : "I don't know about UNIX, I am using on
NT"... but the support on UNIX platforms is as expensive as for NT !
And for the speed of fixing problems, we had very different experiences :
if you contact the support directly (b.e. per EMail), then you might wait
until you fly on Mars before they solve it. We had very good experience
by contacting directly our sale agent (perhaps because he got the lot of
money from us ?).

 --
 Emmanuel Joyeaux                       Draeger Medizintechnik Gmbh
 Software Development           R&D Neonatenbeatmung
 Tel. +49 451 882 3599          23542 Luebeck (Germany)
 Fax +49 451 882 4130
 PGP KEY on request