How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by Jeremy Brownin » Thu, 17 Sep 1998 04:00:00


Hi

I've got some old software which was supplied on floppies with some weird
copy-protection safeguard.

The disks allow me to do a total of three installations, after which the
setup no longer works. Each time I install the SW the number of remaining
installations goes down; and if I uninstall the SW from the disks then the
count goes up again. This has been OK generally, but twice now something has
happened to the installation on my HDD and I've had to reinstall from
scratch. This means that I now have no installations left on my floppies.

What I'd like to be able to do is uninstall the SW (to get the count back up
to 1) and then make an exact copy of the disks for safety. I've tried using
DiskCopy and also DiskImage, but each time I try to install from the copy it
fails. The copy must be in some subtle way different from the original.

Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
undistinguishable from the original?

Thanks

Jerry

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by whoeve » Thu, 17 Sep 1998 04:00:00


Tried this one?
http://www.northbeachlabs.com/

Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,

Quote:>sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
>undistinguishable from the original?


 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by jans » Thu, 17 Sep 1998 04:00:00


Unless the license has run out, you are trying an illegal act.

> Hi

> I've got some old software which was supplied on floppies with some weird
> copy-protection safeguard.

> The disks allow me to do a total of three installations, after which the
> setup no longer works. Each time I install the SW the number of remaining
> installations goes down; and if I uninstall the SW from the disks then the
> count goes up again. This has been OK generally, but twice now something has
> happened to the installation on my HDD and I've had to reinstall from
> scratch. This means that I now have no installations left on my floppies.

> What I'd like to be able to do is uninstall the SW (to get the count back up
> to 1) and then make an exact copy of the disks for safety. I've tried using
> DiskCopy and also DiskImage, but each time I try to install from the copy it
> fails. The copy must be in some subtle way different from the original.

> Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
> sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
> undistinguishable from the original?

> Thanks

> Jerry

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by Paul Mon » Thu, 17 Sep 1998 04:00:00


You could try RAWRITE or DiskDupe...I believe RAWRITE is free, or alot
cheaper
then DiskDupe.
Quote:

>Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
>sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
>undistinguishable from the original?

>Thanks

>Jerry

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by Xylodiu » Thu, 17 Sep 1998 04:00:00


There are some copy protection techniques that your drive simply cannot
copy,
due to the controller and drive design issues.

Xylodius

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by Jeroen van Drongel » Thu, 17 Sep 1998 04:00:00


On Wed, 16 Sep 1998 16:12:06 +0100, "Jeremy Browning"


>Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
>sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
>undistinguishable from the original?

I'm afraid that error can not exactly be reproduced by any
floppy-imaging utility. Especially Neverlock-like protections. You
might want to search Astalavista for a hack.
 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by haptic » Fri, 18 Sep 1998 04:00:00


probably using track 41 or track 81, inaccesable by most image getters
try using anadisk and set the track limit higher.

--
best regards

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by J. Clark » Fri, 18 Sep 1998 04:00:00


In the US he is entitled to make one copy for backup purposes, which is what
he is trying to do.  This is not an illegal act.

--

--John

Reply to jclarke at eye bee em dot net.


>Unless the license has run out, you are trying an illegal act.


>> Hi

>> I've got some old software which was supplied on floppies with some weird
>> copy-protection safeguard.

>> The disks allow me to do a total of three installations, after which the
>> setup no longer works. Each time I install the SW the number of remaining
>> installations goes down; and if I uninstall the SW from the disks then
the
>> count goes up again. This has been OK generally, but twice now something
has
>> happened to the installation on my HDD and I've had to reinstall from
>> scratch. This means that I now have no installations left on my floppies.

>> What I'd like to be able to do is uninstall the SW (to get the count back
up
>> to 1) and then make an exact copy of the disks for safety. I've tried
using
>> DiskCopy and also DiskImage, but each time I try to install from the copy
it
>> fails. The copy must be in some subtle way different from the original.

>> Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
>> sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
>> undistinguishable from the original?

>> Thanks

>> Jerry

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by d.. » Fri, 18 Sep 1998 04:00:00


: Unless the license has run out, you are trying an illegal act.

No he's not.
He has old software, guarded by a stupid scheme to begin with, and he's
trying to protect himself against the certain reality that the limited
counter is going to cause him to lose his software.
It is legal under Copyright law to make backup copies of installation
disks.  If what he is saying is true, then what he wants to do is legal.

A one line condemnation of this poor guy, who is forced to work around some
garbage used by a company that is probably out of business, or wouldn't
have trusted him enough to help him when they were in business, is
groundless.

And besides, your logic is wrong.
If a license was still in effect, he has a right to a working copy.  If the
license expired, he can't use the copy he's got.
There is no point where proprietary software "expires" and becomes free to
copy, if it wasn't previously.

--
---

                - Pope Valley & Napa CA.

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by J. Clark » Fri, 18 Sep 1998 04:00:00


The copy protection schemes work by applying a nonstandard format to some
part of the diskette, or by physically damaging part of it and detecting the
damage.

Central Point used to have a product called CopyIIPC that would handle
almost all copy protection schemes.  The ones that it wouldn't handle were
addressed by another Central Point product called the "Deluxe Option Board"
which was hardware--this also allowed a PC to read and write Macintosh
diskettes back in the days of yore when this was a big hassle.  The one type
of copy protection that neither would handle was what was called a
"laserhole" which was a physically damaged section of the diskette, but the
DOB included instructions for dealing with that.

Anyway, that's what was out there and worked, but try to find either of them
now.  Maybe someone has one or the other that they don't want anymore.
You'll probably need a '286 machine to make CopyII work, though, it depended
on hardware-dependent timing loops if I recall correctly.

There is probably some freeware or shareware product available now that
deals with some of these issues, but I haven't been following that at all, I
just developed a policy that anything that comes through copy protected goes
back to the manufacturer sawn in half.

--

--John

Reply to jclarke at eye bee em dot net.


>Hi

>I've got some old software which was supplied on floppies with some weird
>copy-protection safeguard.

>The disks allow me to do a total of three installations, after which the
>setup no longer works. Each time I install the SW the number of remaining
>installations goes down; and if I uninstall the SW from the disks then the
>count goes up again. This has been OK generally, but twice now something
has
>happened to the installation on my HDD and I've had to reinstall from
>scratch. This means that I now have no installations left on my floppies.

>What I'd like to be able to do is uninstall the SW (to get the count back
up
>to 1) and then make an exact copy of the disks for safety. I've tried using
>DiskCopy and also DiskImage, but each time I try to install from the copy
it
>fails. The copy must be in some subtle way different from the original.

>Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
>sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
>undistinguishable from the original?

>Thanks

>Jerry

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by Karl » Fri, 18 Sep 1998 04:00:00



>Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
>sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
>undistinguishable from the original?

Jerry,

I have a copy of CopyIIPC if you need it...drop me a line and we can
talk about it.

Karl
remove nospam for email

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by Franc Zabk » Sat, 19 Sep 1998 04:00:00


On Wed, 16 Sep 1998 16:12:06 +0100, Jeremy Browning put finger to
keyboard and composed:

Quote:>I've got some old software which was supplied on floppies with some weird
>copy-protection safeguard.

>The disks allow me to do a total of three installations, after which the
>setup no longer works. Each time I install the SW the number of remaining
>installations goes down; and if I uninstall the SW from the disks then the
>count goes up again. This has been OK generally, but twice now something has
>happened to the installation on my HDD and I've had to reinstall from
>scratch. This means that I now have no installations left on my floppies.

>What I'd like to be able to do is uninstall the SW (to get the count back up
>to 1) and then make an exact copy of the disks for safety. I've tried using
>DiskCopy and also DiskImage, but each time I try to install from the copy it
>fails. The copy must be in some subtle way different from the original.

Some copy protection schemes create "bad" sectors by fiddling with the
ECC. Others use non-standard sectors, eg something other than 512
bytes.

Try running SCANDISK A: on your write protected original. It may find
a "faulty" sector/cluster. If so, then copying this diskette by
ordinary means will not be possible. DON'T "FIX" THIS BAD SECTOR.

What you might be able to do is to restore 3 installs to your master
copy. To do this, I suggest you copy the software on your HD to
another dummy directory, say \DUMMY. Then uninstall from the original
directory, say \ORIGINAL. After uninstallation, copy the software back
from \DUMMY to \ORIGINAL, and uninstall again. If this does not work,
it may be because there is a hidden/system file somewhere on your HD,
probably in the \ORIGINAL or root directories. Use DIR \ /AH /AS /S to
locate this "security" file, and then make a copy of it before
uninstallation. You may need to clear the system and hidden attributes
of this file using ATTRIB -S -H filename, or use XCOPY /H instead. You
may be lucky enough to find that a simple UNDELETE may also undo the
uninstall, but I doubt this.

If there is a hidden security file, it may be sufficient to merely
backup this file to a diskette, together with the files in the
\ORIGINAL directory. This backup could then become your new
"installation" disc, thus avoiding the requirement for a copy
protected master. If the software does not run when copied directly to
another HD, it may be that it checks the serial number in the HD's
boot sector for a match with that stored in the security file. If this
is the case, simply changing the serial number of the target HD may
get around this. There is a freeware utility to do this (email me if
you need it).

The use of CHKDSK before and after the installation/uninstallation
processes may also give a clue as to how many files, hidden and
otherwise, are created/deleted by these processes.

Old software often used the Everlock protection system. Look for
hidden files of the type EVDATn.SYS, especially in the root directory.

-- Franc Zabkar

Please remove one 'g' from my address when replying by email.

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by Ian Rohrbache » Wed, 23 Sep 1998 04:00:00


Actually, the law provides for you to make one usable copy of software (installed
onto your harddrive, for example), one archive or backup copy, and to keep the
original.  Plus, maybe he just wants to make new copies before the floppies go bad
and destory the old ones.  Or, like I just said, he wants to make a backup.  Don't
jump to conclusions and assume he is pirating the software.  Think before you
speak.


> Unless the license has run out, you are trying an illegal act.


> > Hi

> > I've got some old software which was supplied on floppies with some weird
> > copy-protection safeguard.

> > The disks allow me to do a total of three installations, after which the
> > setup no longer works. Each time I install the SW the number of remaining
> > installations goes down; and if I uninstall the SW from the disks then the
> > count goes up again. This has been OK generally, but twice now something has
> > happened to the installation on my HDD and I've had to reinstall from
> > scratch. This means that I now have no installations left on my floppies.

> > What I'd like to be able to do is uninstall the SW (to get the count back up
> > to 1) and then make an exact copy of the disks for safety. I've tried using
> > DiskCopy and also DiskImage, but each time I try to install from the copy it
> > fails. The copy must be in some subtle way different from the original.

> > Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
> > sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
> > undistinguishable from the original?

> > Thanks

> > Jerry

--

Dammit, how many times do I have to tell you!  FIRST you*, THEN
you pillage!

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by jans » Wed, 23 Sep 1998 04:00:00


As a software developer I might have been a bit quick on the draw. If the original
owner posted the original question, most jurisdictions, but not all, would allow an
archival copy.
I might share with you that my proprietary products (produced for a limited number of
clients on commission) are being pirated at a rate of 3 illegals to one registered. On
the one hand you might say that that should be seen as a compliment. On the other you
might say that my original response was based on both my clients and myself being
ripped off.

> Actually, the law provides for you to make one usable copy of software (installed
> onto your harddrive, for example), one archive or backup copy, and to keep the
> original.  Plus, maybe he just wants to make new copies before the floppies go bad
> and destory the old ones.  Or, like I just said, he wants to make a backup.  Don't
> jump to conclusions and assume he is pirating the software.  Think before you
> speak.


> > Unless the license has run out, you are trying an illegal act.


> > > Hi

> > > I've got some old software which was supplied on floppies with some weird
> > > copy-protection safeguard.

> > > The disks allow me to do a total of three installations, after which the
> > > setup no longer works. Each time I install the SW the number of remaining
> > > installations goes down; and if I uninstall the SW from the disks then the
> > > count goes up again. This has been OK generally, but twice now something has
> > > happened to the installation on my HDD and I've had to reinstall from
> > > scratch. This means that I now have no installations left on my floppies.

> > > What I'd like to be able to do is uninstall the SW (to get the count back up
> > > to 1) and then make an exact copy of the disks for safety. I've tried using
> > > DiskCopy and also DiskImage, but each time I try to install from the copy it
> > > fails. The copy must be in some subtle way different from the original.

> > > Is there a program that will allow me to make an EXACT copy of a floppy,
> > > sector by sector, byte by byte, so that the copy is identical and
> > > undistinguishable from the original?

> > > Thanks

> > > Jerry

> --

> Dammit, how many times do I have to tell you!  FIRST you*, THEN
> you pillage!

 
 
 

How can I make an EXACT mirror image copy of a floppy disk?

Post by d.. » Thu, 24 Sep 1998 04:00:00


: As a software developer I might have been a bit quick on the draw. If
the original : owner posted the original question, most jurisdictions,
but not all, would allow an : archival copy.  : I might share with you
that my proprietary products (produced for a limited number of :
clients on commission) are being pirated at a rate of 3 illegals to one
registered. On : the one hand you might say that that should be seen as
a compliment. On the other you : might say that my original response
was based on both my clients and myself being : ripped off.

I wonder how one develops the 3:1 ratio information.
I also wonder how much of the garbage copy protection that existed ten
years ago helped any of the piracy issues.

I do know that they caused a great deal of grief at the time, and now that
companies are out of business, they are leaving customers stranded, unable
to reinstall after a hardware failure, personal mistake, or perhaps a
software bug.

They cause a lot of trouble for legitimate users, and very little annoyance
to the pirates.

A friend of mine in Australia had a copy protected software program that
was used to drive a proprietary plotter.  When the software failed, he
couldn't reinstall, because the diskette wouldn't allow it.  The software
house wouldn't send him a new copy until he sent back his diskette.

The turnaround time was over two weeks, for a software product that could
only be used to drive a proprietary piece of hardware.

--
---

                - Pope Valley & Napa CA.

 
 
 

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