Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by David Fran » Wed, 25 Jul 2001 17:12:47



Those here that  steer clear of the advocacy group, have missed out on my
topic:   "A modest proposal". This will correct that oversight, AND  bring
John Dvorak's FANTASTIC INSIGHT article to your attention..PLS READ THE
ARTICLE link below..   btw, I was not aware of this article when I wrote my
little ditty,  (but great minds shud reach the same conclusion)..


Quote:> The next IBM chairman shud take advantage of the anti-trust decisions and
> press MS for a waiver of any licensing enfringements in regard to IBM's
> current working with 3rd party win32 api development AND SETTLE any
> remaining MS OS/2 ownership issues, by proposing they AND Microsoft launch
a
> new company called OS2,  transferring all IBM/MS interest/ownership in
OS/2)
> selling stock via a IPO where each has 25% and the public has 50%

> This would probably sweeten the pot enuf for MS's future cooperation
between
> windows <--> OS/2

> Note that MS seems to be launching initiatives right now to alleviate the
> situation as it stands now, they might like this one as it would indicate
> willingness to cooperate with a windows os.  competitor..

I came across this old article which had amazingly insight for period just
prior to Win95's 1995 release..
Dvorak wasnt visionary enuf (or knowledgeable) to realize that MS has A LOT
TO SAY what IBM does with "its" OS/2 system... He shud have proposed
something similiar to my proposal above...
BTW, I ran this up the flagpole a week ago and not even one warp'ee has
tried to lower the flag,   hmmmmmm...
This MUST mean you warp'ees like it..

http://www.zdnet.com/pcmag/issues/1414/pcm00041.htm

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by William L. Hartzel » Wed, 25 Jul 2001 18:48:13


Sir:
All!  Think a certain troll needs to be ignored.
--
Bill
<snip all previous message for those on modems in pay by the byte telco
ISP.>

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by John Poltora » Wed, 25 Jul 2001 20:57:02



> Sir:
> All!  Think a certain troll needs to be ignored.

It seems like another idiot with time on his hands.

Maybe he has spent the last couple of days trying to download fixes from
Microsoft to plug security holes in IIS so that he doesn't get infected by
the Code Red worm

Pity they didn't think of installing such fixes on their own site   :-).

See:-

http://www.smartguys.net/mshacked/

Quote:

> --
> Bill
> <snip all previous message for those on modems in pay by the byte telco
> ISP.>

--
John
 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by letou.. » Wed, 25 Jul 2001 23:11:35




>Those here that  steer clear of the advocacy group, have missed out
>on my topic:   "A modest proposal". This will correct that oversight,
>AND  bring John Dvorak's FANTASTIC INSIGHT article to your
>attention..PLS READ THE ARTICLE link below..   btw, I was not aware
>of this article when I wrote my little ditty,  (but great minds shud
>reach the same conclusion)..


>IBM chairman shud take advantage of the anti-trust decisions and >
>press MS for a waiver of any licensing enfringements in regard to
>IBM's > current working with 3rd party win32 api development AND
>SETTLE any > remaining MS OS/2 ownership issues, by proposing they
>AND Microsoft launch a
>> new company called OS2,  transferring all IBM/MS interest/ownership in
>OS/2)
>> selling stock via a IPO where each has 25% and the public has 50%

>> This would probably sweeten the pot enuf for MS's future cooperation
>between
>> windows <--> OS/2

>> Note that MS seems to be launching initiatives right now to alleviate the
>> situation as it stands now, they might like this one as it would indicate
>> willingness to cooperate with a windows os.  competitor..

>I came across this old article which had amazingly insight for period
>just prior to Win95's 1995 release..
>Dvorak wasnt visionary enuf (or knowledgeable) to realize that MS has
>A LOT TO SAY what IBM does with "its" OS/2 system... He shud have
>proposed something similiar to my proposal above...
>BTW, I ran this up the flagpole a week ago and not even one warp'ee
>has tried to lower the flag,   hmmmmmm...
>This MUST mean you warp'ees like it..

No it means its a stupid idea, and you're an * troll.

Quote:>http://www.veryComputer.com/

--
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Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by David Fran » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 00:52:31



Quote:

> No it means its a stupid idea, and you're an * troll.

Dvorak is stupid, NOT!    I recommend you read it again..

Quote:> http://www.veryComputer.com/

re: name-calling,  I warned elsewhere such bad behaviour gets warp'ees
wrists slapped with a:

    -> click here  http://www.veryComputer.com/;  <- click here, come on,
I dare you!!

I estimate each time this info is made available a few more warp'ees wind up
biting the dust, sooo everyone thats left here, pls keep asking for this
info to be posted.. Hmmm, who gets to turn out the lights?

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by letou.. » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 02:10:36





>> No it means its a stupid idea, and you're an * troll.

>Dvorak is stupid, NOT!    I recommend you read it again..
>> http://www.veryComputer.com/
>re: name-calling,  I warned elsewhere such bad behaviour gets
>warp'ees wrists slapped with a:
>    -> click here  http://www.veryComputer.com/;  <- click here,
>come on, I dare you!!
>I estimate each time this info is made available a few more warp'ees
>wind up biting the dust, sooo everyone thats left here, pls keep
>asking for this info to be posted.. Hmmm, who gets to turn out the
>lights?

So, are you paid by M$ to be here trolling, or were just born an
*, or did your blowup girl friend say no and now you don't have
anything else to do?

--
-----------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------------------------------

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by David Fran » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 04:57:51



Quote:> So, are you paid by M$ to be here trolling, or were just born an
> *, or did your blowup girl friend say no and now you don't have
> anything else to do?

Gee, at this rate, I will be the only one left and will have to turn off the
lights myself....

click here -> http://www.veryComputer.com/;  <- click here,  come on, I
dare you!!

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by Erick Andre » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 06:02:18





> > So, are you paid by M$ to be here trolling, or were just born an
> > *, or did your blowup girl friend say no and now you don't have
> > anything else to do?

> Gee, at this rate, I will be the only one left and will have to turn off the
> lights myself....

> click here -> http://www.veryComputer.com/;  <- click here,  come on, I
> dare you!!

It won't help you.  You are already in the dark.

--
Best,
Erick Andrews
delete bogus to reply

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by R. G. Newbu » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 06:32:04






> > So, are you paid by M$ to be here trolling, or were just born an
> > *, or did your blowup girl friend say no and now you don't have
> > anything else to do?

> Gee, at this rate, I will be the only one left and will have to turn off the
> lights myself....

> click here -> http://www.veryComputer.com/;  <- click here,  come on, I
> dare you!!

So I did, and all I got was a look at some M*Shit page...

Do I get a T-shirt for doing that? Or do I get to call you an *
now too?

Geoff

--
The Holmes corollary to Murphy's Laws: Any rule or law of physics or
chemistry notwithstanding, if it happened, dammit, it must be
possible.

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by jbr.. » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 06:59:31


Quote:

>> click here -> http://microsoft.com/windowsxp    <- click here,  come on, I
>> dare you!!

I just looked at the advocacy group for OS2 and its really amazing that
there are so many M$ trolls around there considering the state of OS2. Are
there OS2 trolls in the windows groups? Just wondering if it is as one
sided as it appears to be.

I am not gonna join a M$ group to find out tho :-)

John

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by Erick Andre » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 07:27:32



> >> click here -> http://microsoft.com/windowsxp    <- click here,  come on, I
> >> dare you!!

> I just looked at the advocacy group for OS2 and its really amazing that
> there are so many M$ trolls around there considering the state of OS2. Are
> there OS2 trolls in the windows groups? Just wondering if it is as one
> sided as it appears to be.

That's because their empire is now crumbling and they are scared s***less
of OS/2.  Please do believe it!

Quote:

> I am not gonna join a M$ group to find out tho :-)

Unsheath your sword, my friend.  You may just need it to defend yourself
because they do not yet understand the big picture now about the demise
of their monopoly empire.  Good luck!!

Quote:

> John

--
Best,
Erick Andrews
delete bogus to reply
 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by letou.. » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 06:12:02





>> So, are you paid by M$ to be here trolling, or were just born an
>> *, or did your blowup girl friend say no and now you don't have
>> anything else to do?

>Gee, at this rate, I will be the only one left and will have to turn
>off the lights myself....

I guess you can't figure out that you're an *, so yes, I think
we all approve if you opened up the socket and tested for voltage
first with your fingers. Maybe do it from the bathroom shower while
its running. It will help you see the socket better -- just to be sure
the power is on, and all it should be before throwing the switch.

... You probably think I'm kidding, but I'm dead serious.  I want you
get the Darwin Award this year -- and as a troll you just have to a
leading candidate.  

--
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Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by mike steph » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 13:00:56


As a user of OS/2 since version 1.1, and as a beta tester and
developer of the Microsoft OS/2 effort, and as an employee of IBM from
1992 - 1994, I can assure you that Dvorak was and is correct in most
of what he stated.  Akers was going to split the company apart, and in
hindsight I think that would have been the best thing for OS/2.  
However Microsoft would never have allowed it.

With the exception of his parting remark about the advocates of OS2,
the article is right on the money.  His parting remark is not so
wrong, but that the advocacy of the OS/2 users was unknown to most of
the Windows users.  Lots of pressure from Microsoft to disparage OS/2
users and advocates, and lots of "private conversations from Microsoft
reps" to diss OS/2. Besides.... the advocates only did  enough to get
barely noticed.  Certainly the advocates of OS/2 did nothing to harm
OS/2 at the time, and in reality, were only able to do a very small
amount.

I was present at  Team OS/2 functions at ALL Las Vegas Comdex shows
from 1991- 1995.  I have about 7 pink golf shirts from 7 different
expositions.  I assure you that Teamos2 did nothing to harm OS/2's
acceptance in those days, and indeed they (Team OS/2) got a fair
amount of good press for the volunteer work they did.  Microsoft
employed over 150 people a the Comdex shows to directly support
Windows 95 in the same way 100 volunteers did for OS/2. Microsoft was
very afraid of OS/2's success, and paid many hundreds of thousands of
dollars to "so called Windows advocates to spread the word".

Long before the Internets web based popularity, Microsoft disparaged
OS/2 among the bulletin board Operators as well.  The Fidonet BBS
network was comprised of over 30% OS/2 based BBS hosts.  Within 2
years of OS/2 2.0's arrival in the marketplace, 30% of all BBS hosts
were running OS/2.  This scared the *out of Gates, as we all know
his plan to world domination started to manifest itself as his vision
of a huge BBS system (known today as MSN) and the amateur BBS network
of Fidonet was one technology he was keeping very aware of.

Remember that the only OS Microsoft had during that time was Windows
3.1 and DOS.  There was no comparison for technical supremacy between
Windows 3.1 and OS/2.  The problem was in trying to teach the "so
called expert press like Dvorak" how to use OS/2.  They all reacted
like they knew everything they needed to know about Windows and had no
need for OS/2. In a nutshell, at the time OS/2 was too hard for most
of the press to learn.  Why do I know this?  

I Tried to teach a number of the press at the Comdex show, and I
assure you most of them had no idea how to use and or understand the
WPS and the fundamentals of OS/2.  It was far beyond them at the time,
as well as most of the other members of the press.  The one member of
the press that actually did learn how to use OS/2 was Jerry Pournell.
He loved it and quickly adopted it for a year or so. Jerry was an
admitted end user type of user and had no preconceptions like Dvorak
had.

Once Team OS/2 advocates were able to demonstrate OS/2 to Windows
users there was a very high rate of acceptance.  I admit though that
OS/2  was too much for the average computer user.  I remember
discussing the Teamos2 efforts after the show and remarking that the
popular press everyone held in such high esteem were really no better
than average end users in knowledge of computers.  It sure surprised
me how dense some of them were about the industry they wrote about.

BTW Dvorak in my opinion was a bit better than the average user, but
in my opinion he was not anywhere as well versed in computer skills as
were the majority of the members of Team OS/2.

Mike Stephen



> > The next IBM chairman shud take advantage of the anti-trust decisions and
> > press MS for a waiver of any licensing enfringements in regard to IBM's
> > current working with 3rd party win32 api development AND SETTLE any
> > remaining MS OS/2 ownership issues, by proposing they AND Microsoft launch
> a
> > new company called OS2,  transferring all IBM/MS interest/ownership in
> OS/2)
> > selling stock via a IPO where each has 25% and the public has 50%

> > This would probably sweeten the pot enuf for MS's future cooperation
> between
> > windows <--> OS/2

> > Note that MS seems to be launching initiatives right now to alleviate the
> > situation as it stands now, they might like this one as it would indicate
> > willingness to cooperate with a windows os.  competitor..

> I came across this old article which had amazingly insight for period just
> prior to Win95's 1995 release..
> Dvorak wasnt visionary enuf (or knowledgeable) to realize that MS has A LOT
> TO SAY what IBM does with "its" OS/2 system... He shud have proposed
> something similiar to my proposal above...
> BTW, I ran this up the flagpole a week ago and not even one warp'ee has
> tried to lower the flag,   hmmmmmm...
> This MUST mean you warp'ees like it..

> http://www.veryComputer.com/

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by lifed.. » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 13:05:26



Quote:>I guess you can't figure out that you're an *, so yes, I think we
>all approve if you opened up the socket

I've missed most of this drivel, but I'd like to know, just for
curiosity's sake, what would be so bad about somebody other than IBM
owning OS/2?

Jim L
When ugly sticks are outlawed, only outlaws will have ugly sticks. MR/2
ICE, version 2.27  Snip XX to Email

 
 
 

Dvorak's 1995 note to IBM: Sell the OS/2 division

Post by The Queen of Cans and Jar » Thu, 26 Jul 2001 14:02:59




> >I guess you can't figure out that you're an *, so yes, I think we
> >all approve if you opened up the socket

> I've missed most of this drivel, but I'd like to know, just for
> curiosity's sake, what would be so bad about somebody other than IBM
> owning OS/2?

Well, somebody else, sure?  But Microsoft???????  Ugh.  GMAB.
 
 
 

1. IBM Sold Record Numbers Of OS/2 Warp At End Of 1995

AUSTIN, Texas, January 23 . . . IBM today announced record
sales figures for OS/2 Warp, with 1 million licenses
sold in December, escalating the total number of OS/2 Warp
licenses to 6 million and overall OS/2 purchases to more than
12 million.  "We expected OS/2 Warp sales to rise after customers
had a chance to try out Windows 95," said Wally Casey, director
of marketing and brand management for IBM Personal Software
Products.  "December brought us proof of this when our sales
reached an all-time high, capping what we believe was a very
successful year for the OS/2 Warp family of products."

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8. Slow modem during internet connection

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