Very Computer

by **Usman Muzaffa** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

Hi.

I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
booting:

Trying scsi.4.0
Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
ENTRY_INIT status = -4

Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

My question: what exactly is wrong? Before I start hunting down
more hardware and longer cables, I was wondering if I someone could
help clarify what it is the system wants. Does anyone have a drive
that they can positively confirm works for boot/install?

Thanks a lot!
-usman

remove x from above to reply if present

by **Herman Zilverber** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

Quote:> Hi.

> I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> booting:

> Trying scsi.4.0
> Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> ENTRY_INIT status = -4

Did you make sure that the SCSI-bus is terminated right?
Either by setting the right dipswitches or - even better - by plugging
the second scsi-connector with an external terminator (in the case of a
housed external unit)
I had the same problem before with harddisks and cdrom: The unit was
recognized,
but could not be read from.

Greetings and good luck.

Harry

by **Phil Hutchinso** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

Usman,

I ran into the exact same problem last night on a 712/80 with an external
Toshiba
drive that I've been using for 1/5 years. I had a spare HP drive sitting
around that
I switched to for convenience but I am almost sure that I used this Toshiba
drive
in the past to do a cold install on the same machine. I do know that the
hi-lo
scsi cable was changed, but it worked ok with the HP drive.

Phil

> Hi.

> I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> booting:

> Trying scsi.4.0
> Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> ENTRY_INIT status = -4

> Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
> kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
> Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
> same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
> So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

> Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
> or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

> My question: what exactly is wrong? Before I start hunting down
> more hardware and longer cables, I was wondering if I someone could
> help clarify what it is the system wants. Does anyone have a drive
> that they can positively confirm works for boot/install?

> Thanks a lot!
> -usman

> remove x from above to reply if present

by **Usman Muzaffa** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

> I ran into the exact same problem last night on a 712/80 with an
> external Toshiba drive that I've been using for 1/5 years. I
> had a spare HP drive sitting around that I switched to for
> convenience but I am almost sure that I used this Toshiba drive
> in the past to do a cold install on the same machine.

Phil -

Thanks for the reply. It looks more and more like only HP drives will
do. I just checked HP's site and their 32x external cdrom
(model C6512A) has a street price of like $350. This seems very high
to me, especially since I got the cpu for free. But the specs specfically
say that it is compatible with HP-UX and B/J/C class HP workstations.

Obviously, there must be older (and cheaper) cd drives out there
that work - can you give me the details of yours? Perhaps I could
find a unit on ebay or something.

Quote:> I do know that the hi-lo
> scsi cable was changed, but it worked ok with the HP drive.

Not sure I follow you on this last line - do you mean a certain
cable with the Toshiba may have worked? Can you elaborate?

thanks,
usman

by **Thilo Domsdor** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

> Hi.

> I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> booting:

> Trying scsi.4.0
> Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> ENTRY_INIT status = -4

> Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
> kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
> Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
> same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
> So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

> Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
> or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

> My question: what exactly is wrong? Before I start hunting down
> more hardware and longer cables, I was wondering if I someone could
> help clarify what it is the system wants. Does anyone have a drive
> that they can positively confirm works for boot/install?

> Thanks a lot!
> -usman

> remove x from above to reply if present

Just a hint: especially on the 712s (and some 715s, when I remember
right)
there was an issue with the scsi interface. This resulted in not being
able to boot from an external device like CDROM or DDS if you used
the 1m SCSI cable! Connecting an additional device
(and so extending the scsi bus) or using a longer cable solved
the problem! Sorry, I never understood exactly what was happening on
those systems, but I learned to use a 1.5m SCSI cable when I installed
workstations afterwards. Give it a try.

Greetings,
Thilo

by **Lothar Palti** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

Quote:> Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
> kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
> Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
> same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
> So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

AFAIK, Sun CDROMs have 256 Bytes/Sector. HP-UX needs drives with the
standard sector size of 2048 Bytes. I'm using a stock Toshiba XM-3401B on
my 715 without problems for booting and normal operation.

A few years ago, there was an article in the German computer magazine c't
about changing the sector size of Toshiba drives by cutting (or closing) a
small PC board trace on the drive's logic board.

Quote:> Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
> or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

This workaround is only needed for the newer 715's (/64, /80, /100) and
some other newer workstations. It's not necessary for the /33.

--

by **Phil Hutchinso** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

Thilo,

I tried adding 2 additional scsi devices to the external chain with
the same effect. search can see the Toshiba mechanism but will
not boot from it.

Usman,

The HP CD_ROM drive that I used that did work is an:

HP A1999A CD ROM DRIVE
Model TXM3301A1

...from the stickers on the bottom of the unit.

Phil

> > Hi.

> > I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> > OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> > CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> > I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> > booting:

> > Trying scsi.4.0
> > Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> > ENTRY_INIT status = -4

> > Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
> > kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
> > Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
> > same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
> > So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

> > Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
> > or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

> > My question: what exactly is wrong? Before I start hunting down
> > more hardware and longer cables, I was wondering if I someone could
> > help clarify what it is the system wants. Does anyone have a drive
> > that they can positively confirm works for boot/install?

> > Thanks a lot!
> > -usman

> > remove x from above to reply if present

> Just a hint: especially on the 712s (and some 715s, when I remember
> right)
> there was an issue with the scsi interface. This resulted in not being
> able to boot from an external device like CDROM or DDS if you used
> the 1m SCSI cable! Connecting an additional device
> (and so extending the scsi bus) or using a longer cable solved
> the problem! Sorry, I never understood exactly what was happening on
> those systems, but I learned to use a 1.5m SCSI cable when I installed
> workstations afterwards. Give it a try.

> Greetings,
> Thilo

by **Alan D Johnso** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

I use a Toshiba XM-3301 and have also used TMS-5201's on 715/720/735
machines as well as 800 series, I believe that you may have to have the
SCSI ID to 2 , just like HP wants the tape drive to be ID 0!?.

> Thilo,

> I tried adding 2 additional scsi devices to the external chain with
> the same effect. search can see the Toshiba mechanism but will
> not boot from it.

> Usman,

> The HP CD_ROM drive that I used that did work is an:

> HP A1999A CD ROM DRIVE
> Model TXM3301A1

> ...from the stickers on the bottom of the unit.

> Phil

> > > Hi.

> > > I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> > > OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> > > CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> > > I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> > > booting:

> > > Trying scsi.4.0
> > > Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> > > ENTRY_INIT status = -4

> > > Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
> > > kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
> > > Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
> > > same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
> > > So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

> > > Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
> > > or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

> > > My question: what exactly is wrong? Before I start hunting down
> > > more hardware and longer cables, I was wondering if I someone could
> > > help clarify what it is the system wants. Does anyone have a drive
> > > that they can positively confirm works for boot/install?

> > > Thanks a lot!
> > > -usman

> > > remove x from above to reply if present

> > Just a hint: especially on the 712s (and some 715s, when I remember
> > right)
> > there was an issue with the scsi interface. This resulted in not being
> > able to boot from an external device like CDROM or DDS if you used
> > the 1m SCSI cable! Connecting an additional device
> > (and so extending the scsi bus) or using a longer cable solved
> > the problem! Sorry, I never understood exactly what was happening on
> > those systems, but I learned to use a 1.5m SCSI cable when I installed
> > workstations afterwards. Give it a try.

> > Greetings,
> > Thilo

by **Mario Klebs** » Wed, 08 Dec 1999 04:00:00

>> I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
>> OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
>> CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
>> I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
>> booting:

>> Trying scsi.4.0
>> Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
>> ENTRY_INIT status = -4

>Did you make sure that the SCSI-bus is terminated right?
>Either by setting the right dipswitches or - even better - by plugging
>the second scsi-connector with an external terminator (in the case of a
>housed external unit)

Since Sun is explicitly mentioned, I thing, I should write a little
bit about Suns CDROMs. When CDROMs became popular, Sun workstations
were not able to boot from 'normal' CDROM drives, since CDROM drives
did not have a sector size of 512, as a normal harddisk would have.

Sus had its own CDROM drives, which had a modified firmware to map the
CDROM sectors to sectors of 512 bytes. The workstation did not have
any special support for booting from CDROM, it just treated the drive
as a normal hard disk. Since only the firmware is not changable by OS
upgrades, after some OS upgrade it was able to use the 'normal' CDROM
drives on the sun when Solaris was running, but it could not boof of
it.

But this is solved for a long time, and current Sun workstations all
can boot from 'normal' CDROM drives.

Since the 715/33 seems to be relativly old, chances are good, it also
has no special CDROM support but wants to boot of a CDROM with sectors
of 512 bytes.

If this really is your problem, you could try to copy your CDROM to a
spare SCSI disk on a system, which can read it, and try to boot of
this disk.

I hope, this helps at least a bit.

73, Mario
--

by **Ian Spar** » Thu, 09 Dec 1999 04:00:00

> > Hi.

> > I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> > OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> > CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> > I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> > booting:

> > Trying scsi.4.0
> > Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> > ENTRY_INIT status = -4

> > Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
> > kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
> > Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
> > same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
> > So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

> > Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
> > or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

> > My question: what exactly is wrong? Before I start hunting down
> > more hardware and longer cables, I was wondering if I someone could
> > help clarify what it is the system wants. Does anyone have a drive
> > that they can positively confirm works for boot/install?

> > Thanks a lot!
> > -usman

> > remove x from above to reply if present

> Just a hint: especially on the 712s (and some 715s, when I remember
> right)
> there was an issue with the scsi interface. This resulted in not
being
> able to boot from an external device like CDROM or DDS if you used
> the 1m SCSI cable! Connecting an additional device
> (and so extending the scsi bus) or using a longer cable solved
> the problem! Sorry, I never understood exactly what was happening on
> those systems, but I learned to use a 1.5m SCSI cable when I installed
> workstations afterwards. Give it a try.

The drivers used in this part of boot seem quite crude compared to the
normal HPUX ones so it can give the sympton you describe. That's
exactly the error that you get if boot of a CD with a 1m cable so I
would guess you're spot on with suggesting a longer cable.

Quote:
> Greetings,
> Thilo

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

by **Ian Spar** » Thu, 09 Dec 1999 04:00:00

Quote:> I use a Toshiba XM-3301 and have also used TMS-5201's on 715/720/735
> machines as well as 800 series, I believe that you may have to have
the
> SCSI ID to 2 , just like HP wants the tape drive to be ID 0!?.

No, it can be anything for tape or CD. I presume the effect you're
seeing is when you do something like "boot alt isl" etc which is really
just a function of the way the boot paths are set. Something like "boot
scsi.4.0 isl" should work just fine.

> > Thilo,

> > I tried adding 2 additional scsi devices to the external chain with
> > the same effect. search can see the Toshiba mechanism but will
> > not boot from it.

> > Usman,

> > The HP CD_ROM drive that I used that did work is an:

> > HP A1999A CD ROM DRIVE
> > Model TXM3301A1

> > ...from the stickers on the bottom of the unit.

> > Phil

> > > > Hi.

> > > > I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that
needs
> > > > OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> > > > CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI
port,
> > > > I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> > > > booting:

> > > > Trying scsi.4.0
> > > > Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> > > > ENTRY_INIT status = -4

> > > > Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
> > > > kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
> > > > Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
> > > > same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
> > > > So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

> > > > Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
> > > > or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

> > > > My question: what exactly is wrong? Before I start hunting down
> > > > more hardware and longer cables, I was wondering if I someone
could
> > > > help clarify what it is the system wants. Does anyone have a
drive
> > > > that they can positively confirm works for boot/install?

> > > > Thanks a lot!
> > > > -usman

> > > > remove x from above to reply if present

> > > Just a hint: especially on the 712s (and some 715s, when I
remember
> > > right)
> > > there was an issue with the scsi interface. This resulted in not
being
> > > able to boot from an external device like CDROM or DDS if you used
> > > the 1m SCSI cable! Connecting an additional device
> > > (and so extending the scsi bus) or using a longer cable solved
> > > the problem! Sorry, I never understood exactly what was happening
on
> > > those systems, but I learned to use a 1.5m SCSI cable when I
installed
> > > workstations afterwards. Give it a try.

> > > Greetings,
> > > Thilo

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

by **Frank Matte** » Thu, 09 Dec 1999 04:00:00

I have booted my 712/60 from a external and a 715/75 from a internal
toshiba drive
with no problems. Also the external length of the cable was less than
1 m.

Have you checked the scsi id no. I think not all scsi no can be used,
some of them are already used by hp, sam will tell you which are free.

Frank

Quote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

wrote regarding Re: boot 715/33 from cd:

> > Hi.

> > I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> > OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> > CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> > I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> > booting:

> > Trying scsi.4.0
> > Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> > ENTRY_INIT status = -4

> Did you make sure that the SCSI-bus is terminated right?
> Either by setting the right dipswitches or - even better - by plugging
> the second scsi-connector with an external terminator (in the case of
a
> housed external unit)
> I had the same problem before with harddisks and cdrom: The unit was
> recognized,
> but could not be read from.
> Greetings and good luck.
> Harry

by **Eric** » Thu, 09 Dec 1999 04:00:00

> >> I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> >> OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> >> CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> >> I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> >> booting:

> >> Trying scsi.4.0
> >> Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> >> ENTRY_INIT status = -4

Seems to me that this is the error you get when you try and boot a 715
off of the HP -UX 10.20 Server version of the OS. Did you make sure
that you are using the HP -UX Workstation CD?
Eric

by **Alan D Johnso** » Sun, 12 Dec 1999 04:00:00

If anyone is interested I have just found 3 Toshiba XM-3301 external
drives real cheap, havenet tested them to make sure of functionality but

> I use a Toshiba XM-3301 and have also used TMS-5201's on 715/720/735
> machines as well as 800 series, I believe that you may have to have the
> SCSI ID to 2 , just like HP wants the tape drive to be ID 0!?.

> > Thilo,

> > I tried adding 2 additional scsi devices to the external chain with
> > the same effect. search can see the Toshiba mechanism but will
> > not boot from it.

> > Usman,

> > The HP CD_ROM drive that I used that did work is an:

> > HP A1999A CD ROM DRIVE
> > Model TXM3301A1

> > ...from the stickers on the bottom of the unit.

> > Phil

> > > > Hi.

> > > > I've got what looks to be a common problem: old 715/33 that needs
> > > > OS installed. I have 10.20 on CD, and a Sun (Toshiba mechanism)
> > > > CD-ROM drive (model XM-5401TA). The 715/33 only has one SCSI port,
> > > > I plug it in, it's recognized as a boot device. But when I try
> > > > booting:

> > > > Trying scsi.4.0
> > > > Failed to initialize scsi.4.0
> > > > ENTRY_INIT status = -4

> > > > Deja news search seems to show that HP is very picky about what
> > > > kind of drives it will boot from, but several posters said that
> > > > Toshiba drives were OK and that Sun drives (because they had the
> > > > same number of sectors required on boot devices) were OK, too.
> > > > So I thought I was OK, but it's a no-go.

> > > > Several others mentioned stranger tips like using longer cables
> > > > or setting up other devices on the external SCSI chain.

> > > > My question: what exactly is wrong? Before I start hunting down
> > > > more hardware and longer cables, I was wondering if I someone could
> > > > help clarify what it is the system wants. Does anyone have a drive
> > > > that they can positively confirm works for boot/install?

> > > > Thanks a lot!
> > > > -usman

> > > > remove x from above to reply if present

> > > Just a hint: especially on the 712s (and some 715s, when I remember
> > > right)
> > > there was an issue with the scsi interface. This resulted in not being
> > > able to boot from an external device like CDROM or DDS if you used
> > > the 1m SCSI cable! Connecting an additional device
> > > (and so extending the scsi bus) or using a longer cable solved
> > > the problem! Sorry, I never understood exactly what was happening on
> > > those systems, but I learned to use a 1.5m SCSI cable when I installed
> > > workstations afterwards. Give it a try.

> > > Greetings,
> > > Thilo