401K Transaction & Commissions

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Flyi.. » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 00:25:02



I have finally set up my 401K auto deduction on my paycheck in MS Money.  I
have the 401K Transfered to my 401K account as a cash transaction.  This is
working fine.  I have the amount as $200/paycheck AND $50 Employer
matching.  When I go to the actual 401k account and try to "Buy" $125 in
shares for each investment (I have 2 different ones... each gets
$125/paycheck) the transaction will only let me put $100 and then puts the
rest into commission.  It does not seem to matter if I manually set the
amount of the purchase to $125 or $2500, anything above $100 goes into
commission.

What could the problem be?

--
Mike Flyin'8
PP-ASEL
Temecula, CA
http://flying.4alexanders.com

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Dick Watso » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 01:01:11


Can't say just yet.

What kind of Investment defined in Money are you trying to enter the buy
for? What price per share are you using? What quantity of the investment are
you trying to buy?


Quote:> I have finally set up my 401K auto deduction on my paycheck in MS Money.
I
> have the 401K Transfered to my 401K account as a cash transaction.  This
is
> working fine.  I have the amount as $200/paycheck AND $50 Employer
> matching.  When I go to the actual 401k account and try to "Buy" $125 in
> shares for each investment (I have 2 different ones... each gets
> $125/paycheck) the transaction will only let me put $100 and then puts the
> rest into commission.  It does not seem to matter if I manually set the
> amount of the purchase to $125 or $2500, anything above $100 goes into
> commission.

> What could the problem be?


 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Flyi.. » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 02:31:56



> Can't say just yet.

> What kind of Investment defined in Money are you trying to enter the buy
> for? What price per share are you using? What quantity of the investment
> are you trying to buy?

I set up a new 401k account and have picked the two funds I have.  These
are Mutual funds.  The price per share is the price that is listed the day
of the transaction.  (The actual transaction information as far as
cost/share is kept at the broker I use for my 401k)  As for the quantity,
when I set the "Total" in money to $125 and put the cost/share info in the
cost box, the qty is figured out by Money.  The qty will vary for each
transaction since the daily price/share changes on a daily basis.  So...
Here is an example of how it is working for me...


show this:  Total $100, Commission $25, # Shares 10

In reality at the broker it is: Total $125, # Shares 12.5

--
Mike Flyin'8
PP-ASEL
Temecula, CA
http://flying.4alexanders.com

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Dick Watso » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 02:57:07


Try this:

Create the Buy transaction. Delete total dollar amount and then all other
quantities/amounts. Money can be persistent about trying to calculate this
out while you are trying to clear the values. Be persistent until it has
nothing to go by. Enter total dollar amount of the buy. Enter number of
shares. Then enter the transaction. Let Money figure out the price per
share. It should figure out that the commission is $0.

Report the airport in sight.


> I set up a new 401k account and have picked the two funds I have.  These
> are Mutual funds.  The price per share is the price that is listed the day
> of the transaction.  (The actual transaction information as far as
> cost/share is kept at the broker I use for my 401k)  As for the quantity,
> when I set the "Total" in money to $125 and put the cost/share info in the
> cost box, the qty is figured out by Money.  The qty will vary for each
> transaction since the daily price/share changes on a daily basis.  So...
> Here is an example of how it is working for me...


> show this:  Total $100, Commission $25, # Shares 10

> In reality at the broker it is: Total $125, # Shares 12.5

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Flyi.. » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 03:05:27



> Try this:

> Create the Buy transaction. Delete total dollar amount and then all other
> quantities/amounts. Money can be persistent about trying to calculate
> this out while you are trying to clear the values. Be persistent until it
> has nothing to go by. Enter total dollar amount of the buy. Enter number
> of shares. Then enter the transaction. Let Money figure out the price per
> share. It should figure out that the commission is $0.

> Report the airport in sight.

If you are talking about the single transaction (not the entire 2 years of
transaction data already entered) I have already done this... over and over
and over... It always seems to bring the $ total back to $100, remainder
into Commission, and the qty adjusted accordingly...

--
Mike Flyin'8
PP-ASEL
Temecula, CA
http://flying.4alexanders.com

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Dick Watso » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 05:39:25


Then I guess I can't help you. Whenever I do this for the 401ks I track, I:

1) Have investments defined as mutual funds.
2) Use Buy Investment/CD transactions in the cash account with the total
amount for each investment set to the dollar figure of the contribution.
Depending on the plan, I then either use $1 per share and let Money compute
the shares as equal to the total, or enter, as available, the NAV or the
quantity purchased. If the NAV is input, I tab to the next field, letting
Money compute the number of shares, then I tab back to price, delete it, tab
back to number of shares and round to the digits used by the plan.

This has always worked and, done correctly, never thrown a commission or
changed the total value. I have experience with this method in Money
versions from whichever was the first to support investments (M95? M97?)
through M06.

I can also say this: IF you start a transaction that has any of the values
filled in, Money relentlessly tries to hold QTY/PRICE/TOTAL constant and, as
long as it can solve that equation, will put any change in commission.
That's why I emphasized the **technique** I did. I have certainly seen cases
where Money relentlessly tries to do the kind of thing you describe until I
get all the data out and then start putting back only the known/fixed
quantities of Total and Shares or Total and Price.

Is downloaded data involved?

Is Essential (anything) involved (M05/6 only)?


Quote:> If you are talking about the single transaction (not the entire 2 years of
> transaction data already entered) I have already done this... over and
over
> and over... It always seems to bring the $ total back to $100, remainder
> into Commission, and the qty adjusted accordingly...

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Cal Learner-- MV » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 05:54:40




>> Try this:

>> Create the Buy transaction. Delete total dollar amount and then all other
>> quantities/amounts. Money can be persistent about trying to calculate
>> this out while you are trying to clear the values. Be persistent until it
>> has nothing to go by. Enter total dollar amount of the buy. Enter number
>> of shares. Then enter the transaction. Let Money figure out the price per
>> share. It should figure out that the commission is $0.

>> Report the airport in sight.

>If you are talking about the single transaction (not the entire 2 years of
>transaction data already entered) I have already done this... over and over
>and over... It always seems to bring the $ total back to $100, remainder
>into Commission, and the qty adjusted accordingly...

Review your backup situation.

I would try File->RepairMoneyFile->QuickFileRepair first.

Then see http://support.microsoft.com/kb/902466/en-us if the problem
persists.

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Flyi.. » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 06:08:20



> Then I guess I can't help you. Whenever I do this for the 401ks I track,
> I:

> 1) Have investments defined as mutual funds.
> 2) Use Buy Investment/CD transactions in the cash account with the total
> amount for each investment set to the dollar figure of the contribution.
> Depending on the plan, I then either use $1 per share and let Money
> compute the shares as equal to the total, or enter, as available, the NAV
> or the quantity purchased. If the NAV is input, I tab to the next field,
> letting Money compute the number of shares, then I tab back to price,
> delete it, tab back to number of shares and round to the digits used by
> the plan.

> This has always worked and, done correctly, never thrown a commission or
> changed the total value. I have experience with this method in Money
> versions from whichever was the first to support investments (M95? M97?)
> through M06.

> I can also say this: IF you start a transaction that has any of the
> values filled in, Money relentlessly tries to hold QTY/PRICE/TOTAL
> constant and, as long as it can solve that equation, will put any change
> in commission. That's why I emphasized the **technique** I did. I have
> certainly seen cases where Money relentlessly tries to do the kind of
> thing you describe until I get all the data out and then start putting
> back only the known/fixed quantities of Total and Shares or Total and
> Price.

> Is downloaded data involved?

> Is Essential (anything) involved (M05/6 only)?

I do not download any data for the 401K transactions.  The paycheck data is
downloaded.  I use advanced for everything EXCEPT the budget, which I can
not get to switch from essential to advanced for some reason.  I use MS
Money 2006.

Do I need to delete ALL of my transactions in the 401K and then use the
technique you mention?

--
Mike Flyin'8
PP-ASEL
Temecula, CA
http://flying.4alexanders.com

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Dick Watso » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 06:40:08


You shouldn't need to. I certainly never have. Is Money auto-completing the
transaction when you start it and enter a payee? If so, what if you skip the
payee and do a new transaction from blank?

Cal mentions Repair. I don't know that I've gotten there yet on your case,
but it might be worth a try.

I was going to run this tonight (if I get time) and get you keystrokes that
work/"fail".


Quote:> Do I need to delete ALL of my transactions in the 401K and then use the
> technique you mention?

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Cal Learner-- MV » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 07:02:07



Quote:

>Cal mentions Repair. I don't know that I've gotten there yet on your case,
>but it might be worth a try.

If he was entering 100 shares, and it wanted to say total $125 was
$100 plus $25 commission, I would think he had accidentally set up
that mutual fund as a money market fund. That does not seem to quite
match what he is describing. In that case, he would have described
the fixed $1 price.

So it seems way weird.

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Flyi.. » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 07:35:35



> You shouldn't need to. I certainly never have. Is Money auto-completing
> the transaction when you start it and enter a payee? If so, what if you
> skip the payee and do a new transaction from blank?

> Cal mentions Repair. I don't know that I've gotten there yet on your
> case, but it might be worth a try.

> I was going to run this tonight (if I get time) and get you keystrokes
> that work/"fail".



> > Do I need to delete ALL of my transactions in the 401K and then use the
> > technique you mention?

Cool!  That would be helpful.  In my transaction there is no payee.  Am I
entering the data in the wrong place?  Geesh, that would be a bummer.

I go to the portfolio manager and add my transactions there.  When I do it
that way, there is not even a prompt for a payee.  It is simply a transfer
from my 401K cash account to the selected mutual fund within the 401k
account.

--
Mike Flyin'8
PP-ASEL
Temecula, CA
http://flying.4alexanders.com

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Mark » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 08:25:00


Concerning:

Quote:>I use advanced for everything EXCEPT the budget, which I can
> not get to switch from essential to advanced for some reason.  I use MS
> Money 2006.

Have you referenced the following KB article:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/899628/en-us

-Mark



> > Then I guess I can't help you. Whenever I do this for the 401ks I track,
> > I:

> > 1) Have investments defined as mutual funds.
> > 2) Use Buy Investment/CD transactions in the cash account with the total
> > amount for each investment set to the dollar figure of the contribution.
> > Depending on the plan, I then either use $1 per share and let Money
> > compute the shares as equal to the total, or enter, as available, the
NAV
> > or the quantity purchased. If the NAV is input, I tab to the next field,
> > letting Money compute the number of shares, then I tab back to price,
> > delete it, tab back to number of shares and round to the digits used by
> > the plan.

> > This has always worked and, done correctly, never thrown a commission or
> > changed the total value. I have experience with this method in Money
> > versions from whichever was the first to support investments (M95? M97?)
> > through M06.

> > I can also say this: IF you start a transaction that has any of the
> > values filled in, Money relentlessly tries to hold QTY/PRICE/TOTAL
> > constant and, as long as it can solve that equation, will put any change
> > in commission. That's why I emphasized the **technique** I did. I have
> > certainly seen cases where Money relentlessly tries to do the kind of
> > thing you describe until I get all the data out and then start putting
> > back only the known/fixed quantities of Total and Shares or Total and
> > Price.

> > Is downloaded data involved?

> > Is Essential (anything) involved (M05/6 only)?

> I do not download any data for the 401K transactions.  The paycheck data
is
> downloaded.  I use advanced for everything EXCEPT the budget, which I can
> not get to switch from essential to advanced for some reason.  I use MS
> Money 2006.

> Do I need to delete ALL of my transactions in the 401K and then use the
> technique you mention?

> --
> Mike Flyin'8
> PP-ASEL
> Temecula, CA
> http://flying.4alexanders.com

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Mike 'Flyin'8' » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 08:42:49


I rebooted my PC, and then went through the procedure you described
(deleting all the data for a transaction) and try to start with the
$125.  I then added the price per share, and the qty updated to the
proper amount.  There is now no commission.  Who knows what happened,
but something made it start working.

Thanks for your assistance.
Mike Flyin' 8

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Dick Watso » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 09:38:54


I think you just got the sequence I describe right this time. I don't think
rebooting had anything to do with it.


Quote:>I rebooted my PC, and then went through the procedure you described
> (deleting all the data for a transaction) and try to start with the
> $125.  I then added the price per share, and the qty updated to the
> proper amount.  There is now no commission.  Who knows what happened,
> but something made it start working.

 
 
 

401K Transaction & Commissions

Post by Mike 'Flyin'8' » Sun, 09 Jul 2006 10:21:15


:-)

You are probably right....

I am sure, well almost sure, that I did that last night... oh well...
Important thing is it is working right now.

Thanks Again!

On Fri, 7 Jul 2006 18:38:54 -0600, "Dick Watson"


>I think you just got the sequence I describe right this time. I don't think
>rebooting had anything to do with it.



>>I rebooted my PC, and then went through the procedure you described
>> (deleting all the data for a transaction) and try to start with the
>> $125.  I then added the price per share, and the qty updated to the
>> proper amount.  There is now no commission.  Who knows what happened,
>> but something made it start working.

Mike Flyin' 8