Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Terr » Mon, 19 Aug 1996 04:00:00




>Does anyone actually discuss alife on comp.ai.alife or is it merely a
>forum for brainless creationists to spout their drivel...

Occasionally A-life is discussed in here. As far as creationists go,
I think they misunderstand the world around us. Does anyone Really
believe the world came into existence 6000 years ago in a flash?
Suppose all those dinosaurs and billion year old rocks are just
a big *. And yes, I Do believe in the Bible, but it's been
translated so many times that often the original meanings are distorted
or fall victim to language differences. For example the first two
verses:

Hebrew translation: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth
                    And the earth became without form and void...

King James:         In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth
                    And the earth was without form, and void...

See the difference? It leads people to think God made the universe
without form, and void. Look at any hebrew text study, the word for
became is rendered 'came to pass', 'become men', etc. meaning that
it passed from one state in verse one to another in verse two. So
all it says is something happened. If you look around you will find
clues as to what happened to require a re-creation as described in
Genesis. History tells of many catastrophic events, this is but one.
Not to mention it's mostly in figures of speech and do not directly
relate to reality. And even if it did, it Still does not state there
is nothing older than 6000 years as some creationists believe.

Quote:>Actually moving on topic ... does anyone know of a modified version of the
>classic game Core Wars that has had the artificial life element added to it
>such as breeding of programs etc?

Over in rec.games.corewar they are discussing that very idea.

called "Core Wars Genetics: The Evolution of Predation".
If interested I can e-mail you a copy.

- Terry Newton

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by n.. » Mon, 19 Aug 1996 04:00:00



>sure, he helps himself to those who do not beleive in Jeus Christ.

Does anyone actually discuss alife on comp.ai.alife or is it merely a
forum for brainless creationists to spout their drivel a la the comment
above? Having an argument with a creationist is a waste of time , I used
to think that they were ordinary people who just never got taught properly
at school. I now believe however that their main problem is theyre just
plain stupid and cant understand the theory of evolution properly and so
rubbish it. Creationism (and religion in general) provides simple undemanding
answers to complex questions for simple or lazy minds.

Actually moving on topic ... does anyone know of a modified version of the
classic game Core Wars that has had the artificial life element added to it
such as breeding of programs etc?

NJR

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Chris Satchel » Tue, 20 Aug 1996 04:00:00




> >sure, he helps himself to those who do not beleive in Jeus Christ.

> Does anyone actually discuss alife on comp.ai.alife or is it merely a
> forum for brainless creationists to spout their drivel a la the comment

  -- rest deleted --

I'm glad to see someone else is bored with this stuff. I've just only
started  reading this group but I'm already bored with the religious
arguments.  I get enough of this stuff just travelling around London to
and from work.

I wish I could answer your core wars querey. I've seen some stuff about
it recently but I can't remember where. If I find it again I'll post the
information here.

To all those posting about simulating life of some form on
computers--keep up the good work. To those who use this group for
religious debate--isn't there an alt.religion or somewhere else you
could continue the debate.

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by n.. » Wed, 21 Aug 1996 04:00:00



>> Actually moving on topic ... does anyone know of a modified version of the
>> classic game Core Wars that has had the artificial life element added to it
>> such as breeding of programs etc?

>> NJR

>you seem too quick to show your ignorance of the real world.  why do you
>hide yourself in machine intelligence and not use human intelligence.

Hide? What the hell are you talking about? And in case you hadn't noticed
(and you probably havn't) this is an ai newsgroup. I think machine intelligence
qualifies as a valid posting here don't you? Do you even have a clue what
core wars is? Do you know what AI is? Probably not.

Quote:>besides, i did not post the original, and i think that my education
>probably surpasses yours.

I doubt it , every single post of yours that Ive read so far makes you out to
be a rather dim individual who couldnt hold a decent argument in a bucket.
Every time someone comes out with a valid reply to some stupid comment of yours
that you can't think of an answer to you come out with some more fatuous
irrelevant nonsense , your reply to my post being a fine example. Go get a
soapbox and stand on a street corner with all the other mad and sad bastards
or go down your local evangalist church and writhe around on the floor babbling
pretending youre having a religious revelation. Maybe someone will notice you
then but the AI newsgroups are not the place for religious discussions.

NJR

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Bobbie Johnso » Wed, 21 Aug 1996 04:00:00




> Actually moving on topic ... does anyone know of a modified version of the
> classic game Core Wars that has had the artificial life element added to it
> such as breeding of programs etc?

> NJR

you seem too quick to show your ignorance of the real world.  why do you
hide yourself in machine intelligence and not use human intelligence.
besides, i did not post the original, and i think that my education
probably surpasses yours.  dont be so quick to judge that you know not.

Bobbie

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Bobbie Johnso » Wed, 21 Aug 1996 04:00:00





thanks terry, i agree with you 100%.  where did i say that i believed
the earth was created 6000 years ago.. you are exactly on target, but
why judge me for something i did not say?

Bobbie

> >Actually moving on topic ... does anyone know of a modified version of the
> >classic game Core Wars that has had the artificial life element added to it
> >such as breeding of programs etc?

> Over in rec.games.corewar they are discussing that very idea.

> called "Core Wars Genetics: The Evolution of Predation".
> If interested I can e-mail you a copy.

> - Terry Newton

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Terr » Wed, 21 Aug 1996 04:00:00



>thanks terry, i agree with you 100%.  where did i say that i believed
>the earth was created 6000 years ago.. you are exactly on target, but
>why judge me for something i did not say?

I didn't say you said that, I was refering to the general beliefs
of Creationists. Here in Tennesee they actually tried to pass a law
that would require schools teach Creationism along side Science.
Being a scientist at heart I'm a bit touchy about the idea, especially
when careful study of the Bible reveals a world before Genesis, and
the Bible does not specify how old the earth is, just how long ago
Adam lived (what about when they left the garden and found a whole
world of people out there? where'd they come from?). There is no real
conflict between Science and the Bible, only perceived conflicts.

- Terry Newton

P.S. sorry for the off-topic posts. I wonder what kind of
freedom of religion will be given to a-lifeforms? Would
they believe in their creators? (now it's on topic:)

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Terr » Wed, 21 Aug 1996 04:00:00





>> Actually moving on topic ... does anyone know of a modified version of the
>> classic game Core Wars that has had the artificial life element added to it
>> such as breeding of programs etc?

>> NJR
>you seem too quick to show your ignorance of the real world.  why do you
>hide yourself in machine intelligence and not use human intelligence.
>besides, i did not post the original, and i think that my education
>probably surpasses yours.  dont be so quick to judge that you know not.

Now I understand why you thought I said something about you. I haven't
seen the message you originally wrote, I was responding to neil in my
post, he had quoted one line of your original post, that's the only line
I've seen. In the above snippet the original post was deleted entirely
but the header was inadvertently left in. This happens all the time on
usenet. On the quoted transcript above, you didn't say anything and neil
was clearly the one asking if anyone had info on evolving core-warriors.
If you would have said anything in the quoted material there would have
been one more level (>>>). How can one judge what they have not seen?

- Terry Newton

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Keith Wile » Wed, 21 Aug 1996 04:00:00



> > Actually moving on topic ... does anyone know of a modified version of the
> > classic game Core Wars that has had the artificial life element added to it
> > such as breeding of programs etc?

> > NJR

> you seem too quick to show your ignorance of the real world.  why do you
> hide yourself in machine intelligence and not use human intelligence.
> besides, i did not post the original, and i think that my education
> probably surpasses yours.  dont be so quick to judge that you know not.

> Bobbie

Anyone can be educated Bob.  The ability to THINK is something most people
choose to surpass however.  Intelligence and booksmarts do not necessarily
coincide.  Your degrees are of little importance to me.  You've
demonstrated quite clearly here that you choose to waive your right to
think, that's what matters in this debate.

. . .. ... ..... ........ ............. .....................
.. ... ..... ....... ........... ............. .................
. .. .... ........ ................ ................................
Keith Wiley, Electrogenetic Engineer             *
University of Maryland at College Park            *   * *     *   *      *

world wide web:  http://www.wam.umd.edu/~keithw        *     **   **    ***

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Bobbie Johnso » Sat, 24 Aug 1996 04:00:00




> >thanks terry, i agree with you 100%.  where did i say that i believed
> >the earth was created 6000 years ago..

> I didn't say you said that, I was refering to the general beliefs
> of Creationists.

ok, maybe i read your posting incorrectly.

Quote:

> - Terry Newton

> P.S. sorry for the off-topic posts. I wonder what kind of
> freedom of religion will be given to a-lifeforms? Would
> they believe in their creators? (now it's on topic:)

i think that they would believe the same as natural life forms.  i dont
know if plants and animals believe in their creator.  i suppose they
do.  i know that some humans believe in a creator and some do not.  so
if a-life forms are human-like, then they will believe as humans. if
a-life forms are more intelligent than humans, would they have different
beliefs?  or does intelligence have any cognition of creation?  also,
can a-life have knowldege of itself unless it is mirrored so that it can
observe itself?  it seems that the philosophers will be required to
answer your question about a-life rights.  i am rather sure that
scientist can not.

Bobbie

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Bobbie Johnso » Sat, 24 Aug 1996 04:00:00




> >> Actually moving on topic ...
> then but the AI newsgroups are not the place for religious discussions.

> NJR

would you believe that the "religous" postings were an exercise in
logic.  i suppose that is one of you interest.  sure my postings were
illogical and my arguments were deceptive, but seems i caught you
off-guard.  your anger seemed to get in the way of your analytical
skills, not appropiate for a scientist or researcher. if you are as
angry in your work as you are with me, i think your ai might be more
fanatic than intelligent.  be careful that your a-life form doesnt turn
its anger toward you.
 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Henrik Hautop Lu » Sat, 24 Aug 1996 04:00:00





>> >sure, he helps himself to those who do not beleive in Jeus Christ.

>> Does anyone actually discuss alife on comp.ai.alife or is it merely a
>> forum for brainless creationists to spout their drivel a la the comment
>  -- rest deleted --
>I'm glad to see someone else is bored with this stuff. I've just only
>started  reading this group but I'm already bored with the religious
>arguments.  I get enough of this stuff just travelling around London to

Yes, when we voted for the comp.ai.alife group in the summer 1994
it was for the purpose of setting up a newsgroup where we could debate
Artificial Life research, as it is for example found in the Artificial
Life journal, Artificial Life, ECAL, etc. I hope that Chris T. Brown
still has the original "call for votes" that define the purpose of
this newsgroup, and that he (or somebody else) can post it as a
reminder for those who seem not to know the contents of this. Let us
try to keep this newsgroup as a research debate room, as was our
original idea.

Henrik Hautop Lund, research associate
Department of Artificial Intelligence
University of Edinburgh
5 Forrest Hill
Edinburgh EH1 2QL
Scotland, UK
http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/staff/personal_pages/henrikl/

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by Bobbie Johnso » Sun, 25 Aug 1996 04:00:00



> I doubt it , every single post of yours that Ive read so far makes you out to
> be a rather dim individual who couldnt hold a decent argument in a bucket.
> Every time someone comes out with a valid reply to some stupid comment of yours
> that you can't think of an answer to you come out with some more fatuous
> irrelevant nonsense , your reply to my post being a fine example. Go get a
> soapbox and stand on a street corner with all the other mad and sad bastards
> or go down your local evangalist church and writhe around on the floor babbling
> pretending youre having a religious revelation. Maybe someone will notice you
> then but the AI newsgroups are not the place for religious discussions.

> NJR

seems you have some experience in using a soapbox and the evangelistic
church, are you a convert to ai? and yes, i know of the program you
asked about.  if you have a specific question, i will try to answer it.
and besides, this thread is not only dealing with religion, but how
people in the ai group respond to illogical questions outside their
interest.  it seems strange that i had to resort to elementary illogical
postings before some people realized what i was doing.  and apparently
some still do not know what is going on..
 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by n.. » Sun, 25 Aug 1996 04:00:00



>seems you have some experience in using a soapbox and the evangelistic
>church, are you a convert to ai? and yes, i know of the program you

Maybe in your simplistic world view ai is a type of religion, as far as I'm
concerned its a topic.

Quote:>asked about.  if you have a specific question, i will try to answer it.

If you knew about it why didnt you reply to my original question instead
of coming out with a load of bull?

Quote:>and besides, this thread is not only dealing with religion, but how
>people in the ai group respond to illogical questions outside their
>interest.  it seems strange that i had to resort to elementary illogical

Have you grasped the point of seperate newgroups on usenet? In case you
haven't dopey its because people want to read about certain topics. I'm
sure you'd be happy just with one big world.misc group , for me though I
come here to read about AI/alife.

Quote:>postings before some people realized what i was doing.  and apparently
>some still do not know what is going on..

So what is the point? Some sort of little experiment on your part? What has
is proved , that people don't want to read about off topic stuff on newsgroups?
Why don't you go and post about AI on one of the alt.religion groups and
see if theyre happy about reading your posts.

NJR

 
 
 

Is there any alife on comp.ai.alife?

Post by n.. » Sun, 25 Aug 1996 04:00:00



Quote:>would you believe that the "religous" postings were an exercise in
>logic.

No. Exercise in futility maybe...

Quote:>illogical and my arguments were deceptive, but seems i caught you

Deceptive? Try "rubbish".

Quote:>off-guard.  your anger seemed to get in the way of your analytical
>skills, not appropiate for a scientist or researcher. if you are as

Well I'm neither so it doesnt matter does it. Not that anger really comes into
it , you're an endless source of amu*t actually :) Incidently do you really
think only people in academic or research institutions read these groups?

Quote:>angry in your work as you are with me, i think your ai might be more
>fanatic than intelligent.  be careful that your a-life form doesnt turn
>its anger toward you.

Yeah , I'll have to be carefull it doesnt start firing paper at me out of
the printer , one too many form feeds and I could be a gonner.... :)
Did you learn to write complete bull all by yourself or were you taught?
I have to admit you're pretty good at it.

NJR

NB: I'm not going to do what you do and bore people to death on here
with this thread so I wont be replying to you again , you're posts are a
waste of space anyway. Have the last word on me...

 
 
 

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