Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Francisco X DeJes » Thu, 29 Oct 1992 04:35:07



I've been following the discussion here closely, and seeing as how I'm the
one setting up the site, I thought I'd clear up a few things :-)

First off, thanks to all the people who expressed interest and mostly to
those who have offered to contribute models and/or write converter utilities.

Now... what WE ("we" meaning "the guys who own the machine and hard disk
space where the archive is being set up") use here is Wavefront. That means
that what we will absolutely definately want and support on this site are
wavefront .obj files, and utilities (converters, etc) for them.

That does NOT mean everything else goes out the window. Quite the contrary.
I'd love it if we can have our site be *the* place to go when you have an
object in one format and want to convert it to any specific other. Any 3D
object converters will be welcome.

What about which 3D object file format? Again, we will have .obj files, and
will try to have every object we get converted into this. From what I have
been reading, the best thing for everyone else will be to have the original
object files available in whatever format they came in. We do *not* want to
push a specific format onto everyone. It's obvious from the discussion here
that nobody can agree on which one format to use. So, hopefully, if you want
an object for a renderer which takes in format ABC, we will have such an
object available... in .obj format and the XYZ format the person who created
the object used. If such a beast as an XYZ-to-ABC converter exists, we hope
we'll have it. If not, maybe there's an XYZ-to-BASE converter and an
accompanying BASE-to-ABC converter. What BASE is depends on what converters
we have and/or get from you.

If you think there's a 3D file format that's the universal best, provide the
converters for it and we'll carry them. If everyone else agrees maybe all
the contributed objects will come in using that format.

This is the only way I can see to be fair to everyone's needs and wants, and
meet our own needs. We do not have unlimited resources, but we're offering
what we have. Everyone happy?

I'm currently testing the ftp server. If I'm pleased with the way it works
I'll post the address to reach in the next day or so and the site will be
officially open for business.

So... if you have any objects, converters, or know of any place where to get
a handful, be ready, because we'll need a lot of people who know how to use
the ftp "send" command as well as the "get" :-). Oh yeah... I was thinking
it might be a good idea for people who send objects to send an accompanying
picture (a small GIF or something) so everyone else can see what the object
looks like when rendered. Anyone else agree?

Other misc issues: CD-ROM support? Yeah, right... limited resources, remember?
If someone out there offers to, though, be my guest. Email server: I've had
at least one request to support this. If there are more I'll look into it
but mind you, object files are usually very LARGE! Any other questions/ideas/
suggestions? Now's the time!!!


you but my mail bounced. If you read this: we're interested. Email me again
and send me your number.

--

disclaimer: "Opinions expressed here are mine. Typos and errors are all yours."

 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Ben Hollingswor » Thu, 29 Oct 1992 13:14:35



Quote:>So... if you have any objects, converters, or know of any place where to get
>a handful, be ready, because we'll need a lot of people who know how to use
>the ftp "send" command as well as the "get" :-). Oh yeah... I was thinking
>it might be a good idea for people who send objects to send an accompanying
>picture (a small GIF or something) so everyone else can see what the object
>looks like when rendered. Anyone else agree?

I'd also like to see thorough specs for various 3D formats placed here,
even if there aren't any datasets in that format on this site.  One of the
toughest parts about writing conversion software is getting specs on the
formats.

I've got several dozen image descriptions here at UNL, but I don't know if
the format they're in is any kind of standard or not.  I'd love to convert
them to something useful, if only I knew to what...

                                -- Obi-Wan

--
 |\_/|  AACK! ||  Genius may have its   ||  "Obi-Wan" (Ben Hollingsworth)
\'o.0'/       ||  limitations, but      ||  MicroImages, Inc.  Lincoln, Nebraska
=(___)=       ||  stupidity is not thus ||  University of Nebraska - Lincoln


 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Bell Sco » Thu, 29 Oct 1992 18:02:48


        If there is anyone out there with Electric Image, the Transporter part
will convert from QUITE a few formats to QUITE a few other formats.  I might
suggest that if you (the FTP setter-upper) can, you might acquire this package
also.  For an idea of its usefulness, look at Terminator II.  Nearly all FX
were done in EIAS (Electric Image Animation System).

Scott

 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Bernie Roe » Thu, 29 Oct 1992 22:19:45



Quote:>Now... what WE ("we" meaning "the guys who own the machine and hard disk
>space where the archive is being set up") use here is Wavefront. That means
>that what we will absolutely definately want and support on this site are
>wavefront .obj files, and utilities (converters, etc) for them.

Fair enough, it's your site -- and as you point out, converters can solve a
lot of the problems.  Tell us more about Wavefront format; is it easy to
parse?  What kind of primitives does it use?  (polys, patches, CSG...?)

If you could post the format, it would answer a lot of our questions.
I've posted a couple of times asking for the RIB spec, and only one person
even replied (by email), saying we could each *buy* the spec(!)

Experience has show that in order for *any* format to be widely-supported
(even at the level of just having converters for it) the spec must be freely
available to anyone who wants to use it.

In fact, I'd suggest a directory on the site just for keeping file format
specs.

What Wavefront converters will you be able to make available?
(We would need source, of course, since we're all on different platforms).

Quote:>We do not have unlimited resources, but we're offering
>what we have. Everyone happy?

Yup -- it's nice to have a site for these things, anyway!

Quote:>I was thinking
>it might be a good idea for people who send objects to send an accompanying
>picture (a small GIF or something) so everyone else can see what the object
>looks like when rendered. Anyone else agree?

Agreed!  I'd suggest a directory for each object, containing the object in
its "native" form (with whatever texture files and so forth that accompany
it) and a *small* (say 320x200x256) GIF of what the object looks like
(possibly several small GIFs in the same file, showing the object from
different angles, where appropriate).

Also, a simple text description of the object (including an indication of
where it came from, who built it, and how complex it is (number of polys, for
example).

It would also be nice (yes, I know I'm creating extra work for you to do...)
to have a single file that lists all the objects available on the site,
with a one-line entry giving a description of what the object is and what
format it's in.

--
        Bernie Roehl, University of Waterloo Electrical Engineering Dept

        BangPath: uunet!watmath!sunee!broehl
        Voice:  (519) 885-1211 x 2607 [work]

 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Francisco X DeJes » Fri, 30 Oct 1992 03:15:40



>lot of the problems.  Tell us more about Wavefront format; is it easy to
>parse?  What kind of primitives does it use?  (polys, patches, CSG...?)

>If you could post the format, it would answer a lot of our questions.

I will see if the format is in the docs. Someone from Wavefront actually
contacted me to ask if I'd be interested in the format description (yes!),
but I couldn't contact him by email. If you're out there... :-) If I get it,
I'll post it and put it on the ftp server (so long as there are no legal
complications...)

Quote:>In fact, I'd suggest a directory on the site just for keeping file format
>specs.

Someone else just suggested that. Good idea. Any specs people send me or I
can get I'll put in there.

Quote:>What Wavefront converters will you be able to make available?
>(We would need source, of course, since we're all on different platforms).

Any converters I get, or can make, will be available. Sources available,
naturally.

Quote:>Agreed!  I'd suggest a directory for each object, containing the object in

The directories/subdirs will undoubtedly change (morph?:) as user needs
demand it. We'll see how that goes...

Quote:>It would also be nice (yes, I know I'm creating extra work for you to do...)
>to have a single file that lists all the objects available on the site,

Again, we'll see. I'm still testing out all the different options on the
server and hope to make it available by tomorrow. After that, the ftp
site will reflect the contributors...

--

disclaimer: "Opinions expressed here are mine. Typos and errors are all yours."

 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by dave mart » Fri, 30 Oct 1992 09:58:14


...
: it) and a *small* (say 320x200x256) GIF of what the object looks like
: (possibly several small GIFs in the same file, showing the object from
: different angles, where appropriate).

How about JPEG?

: --
:       Bernie Roehl, University of Waterloo Electrical Engineering Dept

:       BangPath: uunet!watmath!sunee!broehl
:       Voice:  (519) 885-1211 x 2607 [work]

 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Darren Bur » Fri, 30 Oct 1992 04:28:44



Quote:>In fact, I'd suggest a directory on the site just for keeping file format
>specs.

Sounds like a good idea.  Trying to track down documents on formats can
be a pain.

Quote:>>I was thinking
>>it might be a good idea for people who send objects to send an accompanying
>>picture (a small GIF or something) so everyone else can see what the object
>>looks like when rendered. Anyone else agree?
>Agreed!  I'd suggest a directory for each object, containing the object in
>its "native" form (with whatever texture files and so forth that accompany
>it) and a *small* (say 320x200x256) GIF of what the object looks like
>(possibly several small GIFs in the same file, showing the object from
>different angles, where appropriate).

Pictures might be nice to have, but it shouldn't be *expected* that a GIF
be provided by whoever uploads an object.  Somebody may have a bunch of
objects and may wish to upload them, but that doesn't mean that they have
the time (or the means) to render them all to GIF files.  I still think
it's a good idea if a small number of GIF files exist with an object,
perhaps rendered by different people and different software.  In other
words, if you know there isn't a GIF of a particular object on the site,
and you're proud of your GIF, by all means upload it.  My 2 cents worth.

Quote:>It would also be nice (yes, I know I'm creating extra work for you to do...)
>to have a single file that lists all the objects available on the site,
>with a one-line entry giving a description of what the object is and what
>format it's in.

The single file idea is great, or at least a file like ls-lR.Z (a listing
of all the files).  If there were a README or a description file associated
with each object, it would be easy to have an automatic script run every
once in a while which would collect these descriptions together.  The
script would just list files associated with each object and would include
the README file from each object in the single file.

This would be a tremendous help to underprivileged people like me who
don't have direct FTP access.  I have to use an email server, so it's not
interactive.  I can't browse (well, I can, but it takes days).  That's why
a single file describing each object and giving the exact path to get it
would be such a boon.

I'd be happy to write such a script, but anyone could do it in 5 minutes
-- it's very simple.

Regards,
Darren Burns

 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Ben Hollingswor » Thu, 29 Oct 1992 13:14:35


Organization: University of Nebraska--Lincoln  


Quote:>So... if you have any objects, converters, or know of any place where to get
>a handful, be ready, because we'll need a lot of people who know how to use
>the ftp "send" command as well as the "get" :-). Oh yeah... I was thinking
>it might be a good idea for people who send objects to send an accompanying
>picture (a small GIF or something) so everyone else can see what the object
>looks like when rendered. Anyone else agree?

I'd also like to see thorough specs for various 3D formats placed here,
even if there aren't any datasets in that format on this site.  One of the
toughest parts about writing conversion software is getting specs on the
formats.

I've got several dozen image descriptions here at UNL, but I don't know if
the format they're in is any kind of standard or not.  I'd love to convert
them to something useful, if only I knew to what...

                                -- Obi-Wan

--
 |\_/|  AACK! ||  Genius may have its   ||  "Obi-Wan" (Ben Hollingsworth)
\'o.0'/       ||  limitations, but      ||  MicroImages, Inc.  Lincoln, Nebraska
=(___)=       ||  stupidity is not thus ||  University of Nebraska - Lincoln

 * Origin: freudsys.nl.mugnet.org, a private point system  (2:283/303.19)

 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Francisco X DeJes » Thu, 29 Oct 1992 04:35:07


Organization: Science Applications International Corp.

I've been following the discussion here closely, and seeing as how I'm the
one setting up the site, I thought I'd clear up a few things :-)

First off, thanks to all the people who expressed interest and mostly to
those who have offered to contribute models and/or write converter utilities.

Now... what WE ("we" meaning "the guys who own the machine and hard disk
space where the archive is being set up") use here is Wavefront. That means
that what we will absolutely definately want and support on this site are
wavefront .obj files, and utilities (converters, etc) for them.

That does NOT mean everything else goes out the window. Quite the contrary.
I'd love it if we can have our site be *the* place to go when you have an
object in one format and want to convert it to any specific other. Any 3D
object converters will be welcome.

What about which 3D object file format? Again, we will have .obj files, and
will try to have every object we get converted into this. From what I have
been reading, the best thing for everyone else will be to have the original
object files available in whatever format they came in. We do *not* want to
push a specific format onto everyone. It's obvious from the discussion here
that nobody can agree on which one format to use. So, hopefully, if you want
an object for a renderer which takes in format ABC, we will have such an
object available... in .obj format and the XYZ format the person who created
the object used. If such a beast as an XYZ-to-ABC converter exists, we hope
we'll have it. If not, maybe there's an XYZ-to-BASE converter and an
accompanying BASE-to-ABC converter. What BASE is depends on what converters
we have and/or get from you.

If you think there's a 3D file format that's the universal best, provide the
converters for it and we'll carry them. If everyone else agrees maybe all
the contributed objects will come in using that format.

This is the only way I can see to be fair to everyone's needs and wants, and
meet our own needs. We do not have unlimited resources, but we're offering
what we have. Everyone happy?

I'm currently testing the ftp server. If I'm pleased with the way it works
I'll post the address to reach in the next day or so and the site will be
officially open for business.

So... if you have any objects, converters, or know of any place where to get
a handful, be ready, because we'll need a lot of people who know how to use
the ftp "send" command as well as the "get" :-). Oh yeah... I was thinking
it might be a good idea for people who send objects to send an accompanying
picture (a small GIF or something) so everyone else can see what the object
looks like when rendered. Anyone else agree?

Other misc issues: CD-ROM support? Yeah, right... limited resources, remember?
If someone out there offers to, though, be my guest. Email server: I've had
at least one request to support this. If there are more I'll look into it
but mind you, object files are usually very LARGE! Any other questions/ideas/
suggestions? Now's the time!!!


you but my mail bounced. If you read this: we're interested. Email me again
and send me your number.

--

disclaimer: "Opinions expressed here are mine. Typos and errors are all yours."

 * Origin: freudsys.nl.mugnet.org, a private point system  (2:283/303.19)

 
 
 

Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

Post by Andreas Paulis » Thu, 05 Nov 1992 21:58:16


--

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andreas Paulisch                   | IMPORTANT NOTE: Never eat anything

 
 
 

1. FOLLOW-UP: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS/UTILS

Well, the response we have gotten indicates there is great interest so at
this point it looks like it will probably be a go. Some clarifications as
to what we the contents of this ftp server will be:

      - What we want to have: 3D object files, supporting textures/maps/etc
        for those objects, and utilities to convert files between different
        3D file formats. 3D graphic demos and/or PD raytracers are already
        collected and available at other big sites, so I don't want to
        waste HD space by having duplicates of those.

      - Since we use Wavefront, that's our main file format for 3D
        objects (.obj files). We *do* want to support other file formats,
        so long as we can get a converter utility for them. For those
        who wish to contribute: if you have a model in a weird format,
        try to send us a utility that will convert it to something more
        common or at least a short text file describing this format.
        I'm particularly interested in DXF-to-anything and anything-to-DXF
        converters.

      - I'd also be interested in having any programs that can be useful
        to those making or viewing these models.

So, basically this will be a "repository" for objects and supporting files.
We'll probably expand on this as time goes by (and as our resources allow),
but for now, that's it. BTW, whatever file formats we carry, we're *NOT*
going to add to the chaos by creating a new one! I've seen several posts
regarding a format called "OFF" which sounds promising as a base-format.
Could someone please forward me some info on that?

Any comments/suggestions/opinions are more than welcome, as now would be
the best time for us to hear them! I'll be setting up the server and files
soon and will post again once the site is ready. In the meantime, start
digging up those cool models you have because everyone else wants to
see them too!

--

disclaimer: "Opinions expressed here are mine. Typos and errors are all yours."

2. isosurfacing code

3. Follow-up #2: FTP SITE FOR 3D MODELS...

4. clipart

5. ftp sites for 3D models

6. TNT2, Quake III, and PixelFormat

7. MORE ON 3D MODEL FORMATS, FTP SITE, etc

8. listserv?

9. FTP SITE FOR 3D OBJECT MODELS/UTILITIES

10. ftp sites for 3D models

11. ftp sites for 3D solid modeling TIFFS ?

12. FTP SITE FOR 3D OBJECT MODELS/UTILITIES

13. Any ftp sites for Wavefront object models?