Opening raw files in CS

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Jytz » Mon, 24 May 2004 10:32:56



I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

thanks

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Lione » Mon, 24 May 2004 11:58:11



Quote:>I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
>correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
>better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
>applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

In general, it's better to do as many of your adjustments as possible in
the RAW dialog. The advantage is that the RAW converter has more data
available to it at that point, & it get stripped out when the image is
transferred to the main program.

--
   W          
 . | ,. w ,   "Some people are alive only because
  \|/  \|/     it is illegal to kill them."    Perna condita delenda est
---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Alfred Molo » Mon, 24 May 2004 14:37:07



>I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
>correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
>better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
>applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

In my opinion it's best to do all optimisations before JPEG compression.
Besides if you optimise the RAW file all optimisation parameters (WB,
exposusre, shadows, contrast, etc.) are stored in the Exif data and can
be retrieved later - something you cannot do if you optimise with
ordinary corrections.
--

Alfred Molon
------------------------------
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Olympus_405080/
Olympus 5050 resource - http://www.molon.de/5050.html
Olympus 5060 resource - http://www.molon.de/5060.html
Olympus 8080 resource - http://www.molon.de/8080.html

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Jytz » Mon, 24 May 2004 18:56:47




> >I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
> >correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
> >better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
> >applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

> In general, it's better to do as many of your adjustments as possible in
> the RAW dialog. The advantage is that the RAW converter has more data
> available to it at that point, & it get stripped out when the image is
> transferred to the main program.

But the image is still in RAW format even after it is transfered to
the main program, rigth?
 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by David Kilpatric » Mon, 24 May 2004 20:19:38





>>>I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
>>>correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
>>>better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
>>>applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

>>In general, it's better to do as many of your adjustments as possible in
>>the RAW dialog. The advantage is that the RAW converter has more data
>>available to it at that point, & it get stripped out when the image is
>>transferred to the main program.

> But the image is still in RAW format even after it is transfered to
> the main program, rigth?

no. the moment it opens in the CS main window, it's Photoshop data,
8-bit usually, and all the information you had access to in the raw file
is no longer there. You can't make further exposure adjustments, white
balance changes etc, without losing data.

Do all this in the raw conversion stage.

David

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Johan W. Elzen » Mon, 24 May 2004 22:10:44



> >>>I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
> >>>correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
> >>>better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
> >>>applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

> >>In general, it's better to do as many of your adjustments as possible in
> >>the RAW dialog. The advantage is that the RAW converter has more data
> >>available to it at that point, & it get stripped out when the image is
> >>transferred to the main program.

> > But the image is still in RAW format even after it is transfered to
> > the main program, rigth?

> no. the moment it opens in the CS main window, it's Photoshop data,
> 8-bit usually, and all the information you had access to in the raw file
> is no longer there. You can't make further exposure adjustments, white
> balance changes etc, without losing data.

Not neccessarily. You can also output the data in 16 bits format, in
which case you haven't lost anything and you could make your corrections
in Photoshop if you like.

--
Johan W. Elzenga            johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl
Editor / Photographer      http://www.johanfoto.nl/

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Alfred Molo » Mon, 24 May 2004 22:55:01



Quote:>Not neccessarily. You can also output the data in 16 bits format, in
>which case you haven't lost anything and you could make your corrections
>in Photoshop if you like.

Well, if you choose your black and white points in such a way to clip
away some of the histogram (you might want to do that to have stronger
colours and/or a more vibrant image) you cannot go back without losses.
The best idea is to do all image processing at the RAW stage.

If you want to make some changes to the image later, you can again start
with the RAW image, because the JPEG file contains all information about
the paramaters you used for the RAW conversion (in File Info).
--

Alfred Molon
------------------------------
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Olympus_405080/
Olympus 5050 resource - http://www.molon.de/5050.html
Olympus 5060 resource - http://www.molon.de/5060.html
Olympus 8080 resource - http://www.molon.de/8080.html

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Johan W. Elzen » Tue, 25 May 2004 00:00:34




> >Not neccessarily. You can also output the data in 16 bits format, in
> >which case you haven't lost anything and you could make your corrections
> >in Photoshop if you like.

> Well, if you choose your black and white points in such a way to clip
> away some of the histogram (you might want to do that to have stronger
> colours and/or a more vibrant image) you cannot go back without losses.

That's obvious, but not very realistic. If you plan to do your
corrections in Photoshop, it's obvious that you will *NOT* clip anything
while opening the RAW file. Choosing black and white points will *ALSO*
be done in Photoshop in that case.

--
Johan W. Elzenga            johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl
Editor / Photographer      http://www.johanfoto.nl/

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Bill Hilt » Tue, 25 May 2004 00:01:00


Quote:>> In general, it's better to do as many of your adjustments as possible in
>> the RAW dialog. The advantage is that the RAW converter has more data
>> available to it at that point, & it get stripped out when the image is
>> transferred to the main program.

That's the way I prefer to work too.


>But the image is still in RAW format even after it is transfered to
>the main program, rigth?

No, typically it's converted from camera specific RAW format to TIFF or
something similar.  Maybe you're thinking of the Photoshop RAW format but
that's different from the camera RAW (or NEF or whatever).

Bill

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Alfred Molo » Tue, 25 May 2004 03:35:09



Quote:>> Well, if you choose your black and white points in such a way to clip
>> away some of the histogram (you might want to do that to have stronger
>> colours and/or a more vibrant image) you cannot go back without losses.

>That's obvious, but not very realistic. If you plan to do your
>corrections in Photoshop, it's obvious that you will *NOT* clip anything
>while opening the RAW file. Choosing black and white points will *ALSO*
>be done in Photoshop in that case.

It is possible to do all optimisations at the RAW stage - white balance,
white and black points, saturation, sharpness, contrast, noise and CA
reduction etc. That's the beauty of RAW - further processing after the
RAW converter stage is not necessary.
--

Alfred Molon
------------------------------
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Olympus_405080/
Olympus 5050 resource - http://www.molon.de/5050.html
Olympus 5060 resource - http://www.molon.de/5060.html
Olympus 8080 resource - http://www.molon.de/8080.html

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Johan W. Elzen » Tue, 25 May 2004 04:58:26




> >> Well, if you choose your black and white points in such a way to clip
> >> away some of the histogram (you might want to do that to have stronger
> >> colours and/or a more vibrant image) you cannot go back without losses.

> >That's obvious, but not very realistic. If you plan to do your
> >corrections in Photoshop, it's obvious that you will *NOT* clip anything
> >while opening the RAW file. Choosing black and white points will *ALSO*
> >be done in Photoshop in that case.

> It is possible to do all optimisations at the RAW stage - white balance,
> white and black points, saturation, sharpness, contrast, noise and CA
> reduction etc. That's the beauty of RAW - further processing after the
> RAW converter stage is not necessary.

I know that, and that's the way I work myself. But that's not what the
discussion is about, though. The discussion is about that is not BETTER
to do all the optimisations at the RAW stage, it's a matter of choice.
If you open the file in 16 bits in Photoshop, you *CAN* do it there if
you want. After all, Photoshop has more uptions than the RAW opener has.
It's up to you to use what you like best.

--
Johan W. Elzenga            johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl
Editor / Photographer      http://www.johanfoto.nl/

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Lione » Tue, 25 May 2004 10:00:12





>> >I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
>> >correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
>> >better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
>> >applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

>> In general, it's better to do as many of your adjustments as possible in
>> the RAW dialog. The advantage is that the RAW converter has more data
>> available to it at that point, & it get stripped out when the image is
>> transferred to the main program.

>But the image is still in RAW format even after it is transfered to
>the main program, rigth?

Nope. When you hit that "Ok" button, the image is converted into
Photoshops internal format.

--
   W          
 . | ,. w ,   "Some people are alive only because
  \|/  \|/     it is illegal to kill them."    Perna condita delenda est
---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Lars Ekda » Tue, 25 May 2004 15:38:20




> >I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
> >correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
> >better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
> >applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

> In my opinion it's best to do all optimisations before JPEG compression.
> Besides if you optimise the RAW file all optimisation parameters (WB,
> exposusre, shadows, contrast, etc.) are stored in the Exif data and can
> be retrieved later - something you cannot do if you optimise with
> ordinary corrections.

Just come across this article which might be of interest for the
readers of this thread
http://www.creativepro.com/story/feature/21351.html

Lars Ekdahl
webmaster http://www.ekdahl.org/digital.htm

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Bill Hilt » Wed, 26 May 2004 08:18:06



>Just come across this article which might be of interest for the
>readers of this thread
>http://www.creativepro.com/story/feature/21351.html

Thanks Lars, that was a really good article.  Since I was just shooting my
Macbeth card at different ISOs to check for noise I think I'll use one of the
files to do this calibration.

I wonder if others have compared CS RAW to Capture One's RAW converter?  I get
excellent results from C1 with a Canon 10D and Canon 1Ds ...

Bill

 
 
 

Opening raw files in CS

Post by Stephen H. West » Wed, 26 May 2004 23:58:13




> > >>>I was wondering if there is any benifit of using CS RAW dialogue for
> > >>>correcting raw images (contrast, exposure, etc.) Would it jus be
> > >>>better, or at least the same, not to use any of those corrections and
> > >>>applying the ordinary corrections (curves, levels, etc.) in Photoshop?

> > >>In general, it's better to do as many of your adjustments as possible in
> > >>the RAW dialog. The advantage is that the RAW converter has more data
> > >>available to it at that point, & it get stripped out when the image is
> > >>transferred to the main program.

> > > But the image is still in RAW format even after it is transfered to
> > > the main program, rigth?

> > no. the moment it opens in the CS main window, it's Photoshop data,
> > 8-bit usually, and all the information you had access to in the raw file
> > is no longer there. You can't make further exposure adjustments, white
> > balance changes etc, without losing data.

> Not neccessarily. You can also output the data in 16 bits format, in
> which case you haven't lost anything and you could make your corrections
> in Photoshop if you like.

Unless, of course, there are problems like overexposure or out-of-gamut
colors that get clamped.

--
-Stephen H. Westin
Any information or opinions in this message are mine: they do not
represent the position of Cornell University or any of its sponsors.

 
 
 

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