Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Drestin Blac » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00




Quote:> Okay, here is the test, as far as I am concerned.

> Here is what I can do with my 3 linux boxes, 2 of which don't
> have monitors, keyboards, or mice.  All of these windows are
> being displayed through my main workstation, JJ1.

> I can:

<snip>

What can I do with Windows NT?
15 web sites
DNS
12 FTP sites
shoutcast broadcast server
realmedia server
3 network cards (2xteamed together (LAN) and 1x100 mb/s internet feed (two
T3s))
6 SCSI hard drives in RAID 5 configuration, 2 CD-ROMs
100+ VPN users
200+ File & Printer (5x) share users
1500 Web/FTP anonymous users simultaneously
3000+ internet mail users, averaging 30 actively accessing POP3 at any given
moment
real-time statistics server generating and displaying statistics including
graphics
SCSI tape backup

No too loaded up... don't often run apps on the server but can fire up any
or all of the Office 2000 suit.

Oh, this is on one machine... but, yes, it does have a keyboard, mouse and
monitor.

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Albert Ulme » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00


Quote:>     My dad does that sorta thing for a living (designs and builds
machines)
> and your sentiments mirror his.  He's a control freak when it comes to
> machines.  He's talked to me about switching to Linux over the last
few
> years but he can't find the commercial grade tools he requires for his
job
> (CAD).

Then it's time for him to take a look at MicroStation95. It's fully 3D
and really rocks on Linux.

Quote:>     Linux gives you full control of your hardware.  If you're willing
to
> learn you can do a lot with it.  Winvocates just don't seem to get

this.

How true.

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Leslie Mikese » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00




>What can I do with Windows NT?
>15 web sites
>DNS
>12 FTP sites

[...lots of other stuff..]

So how many people does it inconvenience if you do something
like upgrade the Netscape browser or add an external modem
to a serial port, or any of the other dozens of things that
require a system reboot?

  Les Mikesell

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Drestin Blac » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00


I would never downgrade my system with Netscape so that's a non-issue.
Adding an external modem does never require a reboot.

I guess there are things that would require a reboot - but, now that this
machine is all setup, it's VERY infrequent that a reboot is required. In
fact, I reboot only to apply service packs. It takes about 10 minutes total
to reboot - I'd say the impact is minimal if it's timed right (advance
notice).

Windows 2000, on the other hand, requires no reboots (well, 7 but they are
pretty big changes) so I won't have that problem there. This particular
machine is NT4 SP5 but will get the W2K upgrade in January.




> >What can I do with Windows NT?
> >15 web sites
> >DNS
> >12 FTP sites
> [...lots of other stuff..]

> So how many people does it inconvenience if you do something
> like upgrade the Netscape browser or add an external modem
> to a serial port, or any of the other dozens of things that
> require a system reboot?

>   Les Mikesell


 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Perry P » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00


On Mon, 18 Oct 1999 02:44:44 GMT,




>> Okay, here is the test, as far as I am concerned.

>> Here is what I can do with my 3 linux boxes, 2 of which don't
>> have monitors, keyboards, or mice.  All of these windows are
>> being displayed through my main workstation, JJ1.

>> I can:

><snip>

>What can I do with Windows NT?
>15 web sites
>DNS
>12 FTP sites

Could you post some URL's. I would like to verfiy the responsiveness of
your server.

Quote:>shoutcast broadcast server
>realmedia server
>3 network cards (2xteamed together (LAN) and 1x100 mb/s internet feed (two
>T3s))
>6 SCSI hard drives in RAID 5 configuration, 2 CD-ROMs
>100+ VPN users
>200+ File & Printer (5x) share users
>1500 Web/FTP anonymous users simultaneously
>3000+ internet mail users, averaging 30 actively accessing POP3 at any given
>moment

Let's see. 30/3000 users accessing POP at any given moment. That's 1/100
of the time for each user, or about 864 seconds per day four each user.
This is abouts 14 minutes per day just checking mail. If your average user
logs into POP 14 times per day, that's one minute per log in. Kinda slow.

Quote:>real-time statistics server generating and displaying statistics including
>graphics
>SCSI tape backup

>No too loaded up... don't often run apps on the server but can fire up any
>or all of the Office 2000 suit.

Might as well do something with that stupid GDI in the kernel.

And please explain why the domian you are coming from, home.com, is a
Solaris shop, as I demonstrated in another post.

Perry

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by moribun » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00



Quote:>Then it's time for him to take a look at MicroStation95. It's fully 3D
>and really rocks on Linux.

    Is it supported, in a commercial sense?  I ask because pops likes the
support to be there if need be.

                Damond

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Keith Peters » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00





>>What can I do with Windows NT?
>>15 web sites
>>DNS
>>12 FTP sites
>[...lots of other stuff..]

>So how many people does it inconvenience if you do something
>like upgrade the Netscape browser or add an external modem
>to a serial port, or any of the other dozens of things that
>require a system reboot?

?

Near as I can tell, neither of those tasks requires a reboot.

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Chad Mulliga » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00



->     My dad does that sorta thing for a living (designs and builds
-machines)
-> and your sentiments mirror his.  He's a control freak when it comes to
-> machines.  He's talked to me about switching to Linux over the last
-few
-> years but he can't find the commercial grade tools he requires for his
-job
-> (CAD).
-
-Then it's time for him to take a look at MicroStation95. It's fully 3D
-and really rocks on Linux.

-
Micro station really rocks on NT too.

->     Linux gives you full control of your hardware.  If you're willing
-to
-> learn you can do a lot with it.  Winvocates just don't seem to get
-this.
-
-How true.
Not.

Full control of the hardware is as useful to an end user as source code.

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Drestin Blac » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00



> Could you post some URL's. I would like to verfiy the responsiveness of
> your server.

No, I choose not to. See other messages.

Quote:

> >3000+ internet mail users, averaging 30 actively accessing POP3 at any
given
> >moment

> Let's see. 30/3000 users accessing POP at any given moment. That's 1/100
> of the time for each user, or about 864 seconds per day four each user.
> This is abouts 14 minutes per day just checking mail. If your average user
> logs into POP 14 times per day, that's one minute per log in. Kinda slow.

Now you are getting it... these numbers you are so afraid of that you have
to post replies 3 times to try to sound like it's impossible are not so
impossible at all. What are you so afraid of? One little NT box doing a lot
of neat things?
Quote:

> And please explain why the domian you are coming from, home.com, is a
> Solaris shop, as I demonstrated in another post.

Wow, you determined that my home cable modem provider, home.com, runs
solaris? Woo hoo!! What that has to do with my own choices of OS and my
clients is... what exactly?

please, stop embarressing yourself...

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Perry P » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00


On Tue, 19 Oct 1999 02:36:11 GMT, Drestin Black



>> Could you post some URL's. I would like to verfiy the responsiveness of
>> your server.
>No, I choose not to. See other messages.

Because there is no proof, Drestin. It is not unreasonable for me to ask
you to prove your claims.

Quote:

>> >3000+ internet mail users, averaging 30 actively accessing POP3 at any
>given
>> >moment

>> Let's see. 30/3000 users accessing POP at any given moment. That's 1/100
>> of the time for each user, or about 864 seconds per day four each user.
>> This is abouts 14 minutes per day just checking mail. If your average user
>> logs into POP 14 times per day, that's one minute per log in. Kinda slow.

>Now you are getting it... these numbers you are so afraid of that you have
>to post replies 3 times to try to sound like it's impossible are not so
>impossible at all. What are you so afraid of? One little NT box doing a lot
>of neat things?

No, Drestin, my analysis shows your numbers are Bull(tm).

Perry

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Drestin Blac » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00


Perry:
Last time: What kind of proof would do it? Screenshot of something? The URL
isn't going to prove anything to you and only expose the name of my client
which I do not want to drag into a personal newsgroup discussion. If you
were ever a successful business person you'd understand my reasons. I've
offered a physical visit to the machine. And now I'm thinking that is not so
wise because you are acting unreasonable and I suspect your real reason to
demand the URL is for less than innocent reasons.


> On Tue, 19 Oct 1999 02:36:11 GMT, Drestin Black


> >> Could you post some URL's. I would like to verfiy the responsiveness of
> >> your server.
> >No, I choose not to. See other messages.

> Because there is no proof, Drestin. It is not unreasonable for me to ask
> you to prove your claims.

> >> >3000+ internet mail users, averaging 30 actively accessing POP3 at any
> >given
> >> >moment

> >> Let's see. 30/3000 users accessing POP at any given moment. That's
1/100
> >> of the time for each user, or about 864 seconds per day four each user.
> >> This is abouts 14 minutes per day just checking mail. If your average
user
> >> logs into POP 14 times per day, that's one minute per log in. Kinda
slow.

> >Now you are getting it... these numbers you are so afraid of that you
have
> >to post replies 3 times to try to sound like it's impossible are not so
> >impossible at all. What are you so afraid of? One little NT box doing a
lot
> >of neat things?

> No, Drestin, my analysis shows your numbers are Bull(tm).

> Perry

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Perry P » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00


You can send me all the web and ftp URL's by private email. You haven't.
You can send me *something*, you haven't. You could tell me the hardware
specs. You haven't. If you can offer a physical visit to the machine, you
can certainly email me.

You claims are, at the least, exagerated. Put up or shut up.

Perry

On Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:59:02 GMT,


>Perry:
>Last time: What kind of proof would do it? Screenshot of something? The URL
>isn't going to prove anything to you and only expose the name of my client
>which I do not want to drag into a personal newsgroup discussion. If you
>were ever a successful business person you'd understand my reasons. I've
>offered a physical visit to the machine. And now I'm thinking that is not so
>wise because you are acting unreasonable and I suspect your real reason to
>demand the URL is for less than innocent reasons.



>> On Tue, 19 Oct 1999 02:36:11 GMT, Drestin Black


>> >> Could you post some URL's. I would like to verfiy the responsiveness of
>> >> your server.
>> >No, I choose not to. See other messages.

>> Because there is no proof, Drestin. It is not unreasonable for me to ask
>> you to prove your claims.

>> >> >3000+ internet mail users, averaging 30 actively accessing POP3 at any
>> >given
>> >> >moment

>> >> Let's see. 30/3000 users accessing POP at any given moment. That's
>1/100
>> >> of the time for each user, or about 864 seconds per day four each user.
>> >> This is abouts 14 minutes per day just checking mail. If your average
>user
>> >> logs into POP 14 times per day, that's one minute per log in. Kinda
>slow.

>> >Now you are getting it... these numbers you are so afraid of that you
>have
>> >to post replies 3 times to try to sound like it's impossible are not so
>> >impossible at all. What are you so afraid of? One little NT box doing a
>lot
>> >of neat things?

>> No, Drestin, my analysis shows your numbers are Bull(tm).

>> Perry

--
Show the code....or hit the road.

Perry Piplani                www.open-systems.com

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by Drestin Blac » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00


See my other message, you never asked for the hardware specs. The claims are
not at all exagerated nor radical. Running/working for an ISP doesn't
impress me much. I'll e-mail you so you can stop using that as some sort of
... I don't even know what...


> You can send me all the web and ftp URL's by private email. You haven't.
> You can send me *something*, you haven't. You could tell me the hardware
> specs. You haven't. If you can offer a physical visit to the machine, you
> can certainly email me.

> You claims are, at the least, exagerated. Put up or shut up.

> Perry

> On Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:59:02 GMT,

> >Perry:
> >Last time: What kind of proof would do it? Screenshot of something? The
URL
> >isn't going to prove anything to you and only expose the name of my
client
> >which I do not want to drag into a personal newsgroup discussion. If you
> >were ever a successful business person you'd understand my reasons. I've
> >offered a physical visit to the machine. And now I'm thinking that is not
so
> >wise because you are acting unreasonable and I suspect your real reason
to
> >demand the URL is for less than innocent reasons.



> >> On Tue, 19 Oct 1999 02:36:11 GMT, Drestin Black


> >> >> Could you post some URL's. I would like to verfiy the responsiveness
of
> >> >> your server.
> >> >No, I choose not to. See other messages.

> >> Because there is no proof, Drestin. It is not unreasonable for me to
ask
> >> you to prove your claims.

> >> >> >3000+ internet mail users, averaging 30 actively accessing POP3 at
any
> >> >given
> >> >> >moment

> >> >> Let's see. 30/3000 users accessing POP at any given moment. That's
> >1/100
> >> >> of the time for each user, or about 864 seconds per day four each
user.
> >> >> This is abouts 14 minutes per day just checking mail. If your
average
> >user
> >> >> logs into POP 14 times per day, that's one minute per log in. Kinda
> >slow.

> >> >Now you are getting it... these numbers you are so afraid of that you
> >have
> >> >to post replies 3 times to try to sound like it's impossible are not
so
> >> >impossible at all. What are you so afraid of? One little NT box doing
a
> >lot
> >> >of neat things?

> >> No, Drestin, my analysis shows your numbers are Bull(tm).

> >> Perry

> --
> Show the code....or hit the road.

> Perry Piplani                www.open-systems.com


 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by [radiant matri » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00




: >     My dad does that sorta thing for a living (designs and builds
: machines)
: > and your sentiments mirror his.  He's a control freak when it comes to
: > machines.  He's talked to me about switching to Linux over the last
: few
: > years but he can't find the commercial grade tools he requires for his
: job
: > (CAD).
:
: Then it's time for him to take a look at MicroStation95. It's fully 3D
: and really rocks on Linux.

MicroStation is on Linux?!?  URL, PLEASE!  (woohoo!)

: >     Linux gives you full control of your hardware.  If you're willing
: to
: > learn you can do a lot with it.  Winvocates just don't seem to get
: this.
:
: How true.
:
:
:

--
.:[ radiant matrix ]:............................
. Company policy requires me to withold my name .
. from all non-company-related public messages  .
. originating from our network.                 .
.................................................

 
 
 

Pull out your tools, it is time to measure!

Post by [radiant matri » Sun, 31 Dec 1899 09:00:00




:

: ->     My dad does that sorta thing for a living (designs and builds
: -machines)
: -> and your sentiments mirror his.  He's a control freak when it comes to
: -> machines.  He's talked to me about switching to Linux over the last
: -few
: -> years but he can't find the commercial grade tools he requires for his
: -job
: -> (CAD).
: -
: -Then it's time for him to take a look at MicroStation95. It's fully 3D
: -and really rocks on Linux.
:
: -
: Micro station really rocks on NT too.

Indeed.  But the point was that non-availability of good CAD software was
stopping this person from installing Linux -- MicroStation95 is available,
and works well on it.  Your point could be inflammatory.

: ->     Linux gives you full control of your hardware.  If you're willing
: -to
: -> learn you can do a lot with it.  Winvocates just don't seem to get
: -this.
: -
: -How true.
: Not.
:
: Full control of the hardware is as useful to an end user as source code.

Not quite.  I have no use for source on my machine -- I'm a Java man,
myself, and haven't had the need (or the time) to learn C.

However, having full control over the system has been very helpful to me
many times.  I get to play and tweak, and get the most out of all of my
hardware.  Plus, with modprobe, I can load my sound drivers when I need
them, and reduce overhead when I don't!

So, there is an argument to be made, at least for "power users."  OTH, Linux
often _requires_ you to be a power user, or to have one set it up for you...
So I guess it's another case of "right tool for the job"

--
.:[ radiant matrix ]:............................
. Company policy requires me to withold my name .
. from all non-company-related public messages  .
. originating from our network.                 .
.................................................