Time for COLA to vanish (joke)

Time for COLA to vanish (joke)

Post by Marc Jorda » Thu, 21 Mar 2002 01:14:55



   Given all of the pearls of wisdom I have been reading lately in this
newsgroup and with the obvious success of Linux in all (I repeat in
all) areas it has been used, ranging from desktop to clustered
environments, I think that this newsgroup is not necessay anymore and
we could split it in some other ones :

   1) comp.os.linux.moron-windows-users-asking-for-help (this one would
last forever since few of them will ever be able to learn nothing)

   2) comp.os.linux.moron-windows-users-offending-people (it seems that
there are too many persons willing to say stupidities in the net)

   3) comp.os.linux.ex-advocacy-friends (this one would be just for
talking with friends after having posted together for a long time)

   I think that the third one should even be moderated, otherwise it
would again be invaded by persons from the first and second ones :-)

--

   Marc Jordan.

 
 
 

Time for COLA to vanish (joke)

Post by Mark S Bi » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 13:19:56


On Wed, 20 Mar 2002 00:14:55 +0100,


>I think that this newsgroup is not necessay anymore and
>we could split it in some other ones :

>1) comp.os.linux.moron-windows-users-asking-for-help (this
>one would last forever since few of them will ever be able
>to learn nothing)

That is a very untrue and harmful thing to say!

Who are the audience for Linux advocacy?  Who are we
speaking to?  Please think about that.

We Linux users don't have to be convinced.  We'll never go
back to closed, unfree software.  

The people we're talking to are those who would benefit from
Linux, but aren't using it now.  Since they're already using
computers, that means that almost all of them are running
MS-Windows.

Why in the world would you call them "morons" and say that
"few of them will ever be able to learn [anything]"?

Most people use computers as tools without understanding much
about them, just as we use cars, electricity, medicines,
foods, fabrics, etc., without knowing many details about how
these are created.

That doesn't make such computer users "morons" in any way!
It's untrue, and very insulting to call them that, and any who
have come to COLA to find out about Linux and happen to read
your article may leave immediately, taking with them the
impression that Linux advocates are ignorant and cruel.

If these folks sometimes ask questions that seem silly to us,
or they have difficulty understanding our advice, it's because
no one ever taught them the elementary facts of computers --
what bytes, files, RAM, CPU, etc., are, and how they interact.
With a good set of diagrams, this can be taught in a few hours.

Quote:>2) comp.os.linux.moron-windows-users-offending-people (it
>seems that >there are too many persons willing to say
>stupidities in the net)

Have you confused normal Windows users with the anti-Linux
propagandists that spam this newsgroup?  The latter are an
entirely different and much smaller group, who are either
paid by Microsoft or have some emotional illness that causes
them to enjoy harming other people.

We're selling ideas here, not to get money, but because we
want to help people, and because an increase in freedom
benefits our whole society, and the entire world.  Please,
let's be nice to our customers, and not insult them.

 
 
 

Time for COLA to vanish (joke)

Post by Marc Jorda » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 13:40:15



> comp.os.linux.advocacy (Jue 21 Mar 2002 12:19) :

>>1) comp.os.linux.moron-windows-users-asking-for-help (this
>>one would last forever since few of them will ever be able
>>to learn nothing)
> That is a very untrue and harmful thing to say!
> Who are the audience for Linux advocacy?  Who are we
> speaking to?  Please think about that.
> We Linux users don't have to be convinced.  We'll never go
> back to closed, unfree software.
> The people we're talking to are those who would benefit from
> Linux, but aren't using it now.  Since they're already using
> computers, that means that almost all of them are running
> MS-Windows.
> Why in the world would you call them "morons" and say that
> "few of them will ever be able to learn [anything]"?
> Most people use computers as tools without understanding much
> about them, just as we use cars, electricity, medicines,
> foods, fabrics, etc., without knowing many details about how
> these are created.
> That doesn't make such computer users "morons" in any way!
> It's untrue, and very insulting to call them that, and any who
> have come to COLA to find out about Linux and happen to read
> your article may leave immediately, taking with them the
> impression that Linux advocates are ignorant and cruel.
> If these folks sometimes ask questions that seem silly to us,
> or they have difficulty understanding our advice, it's because
> no one ever taught them the elementary facts of computers --
> what bytes, files, RAM, CPU, etc., are, and how they interact.
> With a good set of diagrams, this can be taught in a few hours.

   No offense meant to any Windows user asking for help (even when this
is not the group) and with the intention of listen to the things we
could say him/her. My offense (if any, since it was a pseudo humour
post) was towards those that to not want Linux, neither like it and
come here just to bash and to post their frustration in a matter to
which they have not dedicated the time it deserves.

Quote:>>2) comp.os.linux.moron-windows-users-offending-people (it
>>seems that >there are too many persons willing to say
>>stupidities in the net)
> Have you confused normal Windows users with the anti-Linux
> propagandists that spam this newsgroup?  The latter are an
> entirely different and much smaller group, who are either
> paid by Microsoft or have some emotional illness that causes
> them to enjoy harming other people.

   Towards those last was my post meant. I in fact spend part of my
free time helping computer users to solve problems, be it at newsgroup,
be at IRC or be it a friend home :-)

Quote:> We're selling ideas here, not to get money, but because we
> want to help people, and because an increase in freedom
> benefits our whole society, and the entire world.  Please,
> let's be nice to our customers, and not insult them.

   No insult meant. I think I have clearly expressed above; anyway
thanks for your posts, I am the first to want to leave things clear,
even when in some cases (more than I would like) my English does
traition me :-)

--

   Marc Jordan.

 
 
 

Time for COLA to vanish (joke)

Post by Mark S Bi » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 17:55:49


On Thu, 21 Mar 2002 12:40:15 +0100,



>> comp.os.linux.advocacy (Jue 21 Mar 2002 12:19) :


>>>1) comp.os.linux.moron-windows-users-asking-for-help (this
>>>one would last forever since few of them will ever be able
>>>to learn nothing)

>> That is a very untrue and harmful thing to say!
>> Who are the audience for Linux advocacy?  Who are we
>> speaking to?  Please think about that.
>> We Linux users don't have to be convinced.  We'll never go
>> back to closed, unfree software.
>> The people we're talking to are those who would benefit from
>> Linux, but aren't using it now.  Since they're already using
>> computers, that means that almost all of them are running
>> MS-Windows.
>> Why in the world would you call them "morons" and say that
>> "few of them will ever be able to learn [anything]"?
>> Most people use computers as tools without understanding much
>> about them, just as we use cars, electricity, medicines,
>> foods, fabrics, etc., without knowing many details about how
>> these are created.
>> That doesn't make such computer users "morons" in any way!
>> It's untrue, and very insulting to call them that, and any who
>> have come to COLA to find out about Linux and happen to read
>> your article may leave immediately, taking with them the
>> impression that Linux advocates are ignorant and cruel.
>> If these folks sometimes ask questions that seem silly to us,
>> or they have difficulty understanding our advice, it's because
>> no one ever taught them the elementary facts of computers --
>> what bytes, files, RAM, CPU, etc., are, and how they interact.
>> With a good set of diagrams, this can be taught in a few hours.

>   No offense meant to any Windows user asking for help (even when this
>is not the group) and with the intention of listen to the things we
>could say him/her. My offense (if any, since it was a pseudo humour
>post)

I'm glad you meant no offence, but labelling bigotry as "humor"
does not make it any less harmful.  We have Fascist radio
broadcasters in the U.S. who spread a lot of hatred against
women, non-whites, gays, etc., and claim that they are only
joking.

Quote:>was towards those that to not want Linux, neither like it and
>come here just to bash and to post their frustration in a matter to
>which they have not dedicated the time it deserves.

There are no such people!!!  It is very important to understand
this!  

If someone doesn't like a piece of software, they might write
one or two articles in Usenet about it, not ten or twenty
_thousand_ articles, which is what they do in COLA.

Every person who posts in COLA claiming to be frustrated with
Linux because it wouldn't install correctly, and then goes on
to post hundreds or thousands of anti-Linux articles here, is
LYING!  They resist all attempts to help them solve the problem
that they claim they are having.  The three examples that I
can remember are "Jeff Szarka", "flatfish", and "wjbell".  
None of them would follow the advice that was offered to fix
their problem.  "Szarka" made the tactical error of giving
too much detail in his description.  It was clear that he had
intentionally rigged his system so that Linux could not
install without some extra manipulation, which he then refused
to carry out even though we told him exactly what to do.  

All of these people are intentional, purposeful, lying
anti-Linux propagandists.  That's why they do what they do
here.  They are not morons, and it is completely incidental
that they use MS-Windows.  Nobody spends months or _years_
posting tens of thousands of articles to Usenet just because
they had a problem with a piece of software.  They do it
either because Microsoft is paying them to, or (much less
likely) because they are mentally ill.  

That's what has been going on in COLA for the past three years
(at least).  It's very important to see through the deception
of these individuals.

Quote:>>>2) comp.os.linux.moron-windows-users-offending-people (it
>>>seems that >there are too many persons willing to say
>>>stupidities in the net)
>> Have you confused normal Windows users with the anti-Linux
>> propagandists that spam this newsgroup?  The latter are an
>> entirely different and much smaller group, who are either
>> paid by Microsoft or have some emotional illness that causes
>> them to enjoy harming other people.

>Towards those last was my post meant.

Good.  Unfortunately you named the first group ("windows
users") as the target, instead of the second group, which
should be called "(lying) anti-Linux propagandists".

I'm not saying this to scold you, just to make it clear to
everybody, because other Linux advocates have made the same
mistake.

It's like having a shop with lots of customers, and then a
few robbers come in.  If the shop owner later screams at all
the customers that they are stinking robbers, the customers
will all leave and never come back.

Quote:>I in fact spend part of my
>free time helping computer users to solve problems, be it at newsgroup,
>be at IRC or be it a friend home :-)

>> We're selling ideas here, not to get money, but because we
>> want to help people, and because an increase in freedom
>> benefits our whole society, and the entire world.  Please,
>> let's be nice to our customers, and not insult them.

>   No insult meant. I think I have clearly expressed above; anyway
>thanks for your posts, I am the first to want to leave things clear,
>even when in some cases (more than I would like) my English does
>traition me :-)

The English word is "betray".  8^)  And thanks for your help
to computer users!
 
 
 

Time for COLA to vanish (joke)

Post by Marc Jorda » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 18:06:06



> comp.os.linux.advocacy (Jue 21 Mar 2002 16:55) :
> I'm glad you meant no offence, but labelling bigotry as "humor"
> does not make it any less harmful.  We have Fascist radio
> broadcasters in the U.S. who spread a lot of hatred against
> women, non-whites, gays, etc., and claim that they are only
> joking.

   I think that you are after all right. The only true humor is the one
that refers to oneself often. I would try not to perform that kind of
humor again, but feel rather far from the examples you gave, let's get
this clear.

Quote:> There are no such people!!!  It is very important to understand
> this!

   Well, in this one I do not fully agree, there are some, may be few,
but Quantum theory tells it must be al least one or two :-)

Quote:> All of these people are intentional, purposeful, lying
> anti-Linux propagandists.  That's why they do what they do
> here.  They are not morons, and it is completely incidental
> that they use MS-Windows.  Nobody spends months or _years_
> posting tens of thousands of articles to Usenet just because
> they had a problem with a piece of software.  They do it
> either because Microsoft is paying them to, or (much less
> likely) because they are mentally ill.
> That's what has been going on in COLA for the past three years
> (at least).  It's very important to see through the deception
> of these individuals.

   My post was in part to try to separate these ones to the persons
that really come here asking in truth.

Quote:> I'm not saying this to scold you, just to make it clear to
> everybody, because other Linux advocates have made the same
> mistake.

   Don't worry, I do not take your posts as personal attack, just as a
friend advice. I do always like to listen to another points of view.

Quote:> It's like having a shop with lots of customers, and then a
> few robbers come in.  If the shop owner later screams at all
> the customers that they are stinking robbers, the customers
> will all leave and never come back.

   Hahaha, yeah a good example.

Quote:> The English word is "betray".  8^)  And thanks for your help
> to computer users!

   Hell betray, I knew I had said it hundred of times in a song (I do
not remember which one right now), it said "betrayer ! betrayer !" :-)

   No thanks needed, I just do for two reasons. One is for fun, and the
another is to help other ones the same way that I was helped when I
needed.

--

   Marc Jordan.