Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Carfield Yi » Wed, 20 Dec 2000 13:38:15



From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?
 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Joe Humrickhou » Wed, 20 Dec 2000 14:35:06


On Tue, 19 Dec 2000 12:38:15 +0800, Carfield Yim


> From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
> edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
> system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
> the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
> that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
> learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
> experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
> there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

Try these:
_The Design and Implementation of the 4.3BSD UNIX Operating System_ by
Leffler, McKusick, Karels and Quarterman
_Operating Systems Design and Implementation_ by Tanenbaum and
Woodhall
_The Design of the UNIX Operating System_, Bach

--
Joe Humrickhouse

www.itlabs.umn.edu/~humr0002

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Josef Moeller » Wed, 20 Dec 2000 16:30:26



> From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
> edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
> system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
> the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
> that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
> learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
> experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
> there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

Although it is a tad outdated, yes, it is a good introduction to UN*X
kernel internals. OTOH I have also seen a book much like the Lion's,
based on Linux: "Linux Core Kernel Commentary" by Scott Maxwell
(CoriolisOpen Press, ISBN 1-57610-469-9). I have inherited the book from
a colleague who has left the department but, so far, I have not looked
through it, so I can't judge whether it is of any use.

Of course, Joe Humrickhouse's recommendations are good books, too.
--
Josef M?llers (Pinguinpfleger bei FSC)
        If failure had no penalty success would not be a prize (T.  Pratchett)

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Chun N » Thu, 21 Dec 2000 02:27:14


I recommend this book:
   Unix Internals, By Vahalia.

It is an excellent book for understanding Unix kernels (various flavors) in
theory. But don't expect  code walk through style  like Richard Stevens'
Network Programming series.


Quote:> From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
> edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
> system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
> the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
> that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
> learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
> experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
> there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Rich Tee » Thu, 21 Dec 2000 04:15:42



> From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
> edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
> system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
> the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
> that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
> learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
> experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
> there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

First, the UNIX kernel is written in C, so you've got no choice there!
Second, the kernel presented in the Lions book is ancient.  It's of
historical interest (that's why I have a copy), but you'll need to look
at more modern texts to geta feel for newer kernels.

--
Rich Teer                                                      .  *   * . * .* .
                                                               .   *   .   .*
                                                                .  . /\ ( .  . *
                                                               . .  / .\   . * .
                                                               *.  / *  \  . .
                                                                . /*   o \     .
Voice: +1 (250) 979-1638                                          '''||'''   .
URL: http://www.rite-online.net                               ******************

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Pete Zaitc » Thu, 21 Dec 2000 07:28:07


Quote:> > From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
> > edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
> > system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
> > the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
> > that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
> > learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
> > experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
> > there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

> Try these:
> _The Design and Implementation of the 4.3BSD UNIX Operating System_ by
> Leffler, McKusick, Karels and Quarterman
> _Operating Systems Design and Implementation_ by Tanenbaum and
> Woodhall
> _The Design of the UNIX Operating System_, Bach

Uresh Valhallia's book with the scavenger on sitting on the BSD
grave is actually good.

The 4.3 book is somewhat interesting but it skims the surface in
many places. I looked at it when I considered doing ufs in Linux,
and it provided not much of a substance :)

Lions is great for historical value. I used to have PDP-11 at
home and it ran the code that desribed by Lions.
There is an attempt to comment Linux in the same way, I saw
it in B&N the other day. Unfortunately for its authors, Linux
is a moving target.

Tannenbaum is the hawk of microkernels as we all know :)

Maurice Bach was great, I owned a 5-th photocopy of it
when it was impossible to find.

--Pete

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Francis Hartoj » Thu, 21 Dec 2000 13:26:23



Quote:>From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
>edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
>system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
>the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
>that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
>learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
>experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
>there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

IMHO this book is an excellent starter into the Unix kernel.  Why?
Because the Unix that's in it is simple, fairly short (~10K LOC, IIRC),
relatively easy to understand, and, believe it or not, parts of it or
traces of it are still visible in the SVR4 code.  Of course, it doesn't
have IPC, STREAMS, demand paging, SMP, networking and other features of
a modern kernel; but, to start with, it's an wonderful code to
analyze.

Another book that may be of interest to you, if you can find it as I
understand it's out of print, is the "Magic Garden Explained" by Berny
Goodheart and James Cox.  It explains the internals of SVR4 and is one
of the bibles where I work, along with Richard Stevens' books (all of
them).

FWIW, HTH.
--
+------------------------+-------------------------------------------------+
| Francis Hartojo        | Ph.:  480-391-8506  [Lucent doesn't endorse my  |
| Lucent Technologies    | Fax:  480-391-8555   opinions.                  |

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Daniel Ral » Fri, 22 Dec 2000 08:03:39




> > From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
> > edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
> > system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
> > the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
> > that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
> > learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
> > experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
> > there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

> Although it is a tad outdated, yes, it is a good introduction to UN*X
> kernel internals. OTOH I have also seen a book much like the Lion's,
> based on Linux: "Linux Core Kernel Commentary" by Scott Maxwell
> (CoriolisOpen Press, ISBN 1-57610-469-9). I have inherited the book from
> a colleague who has left the department but, so far, I have not looked
> through it, so I can't judge whether it is of any use.

> Of course, Joe Humrickhouse's recommendations are good books, too.

The "Linux Core Kernel Commentary" is interesting, but already sorely
out of date.

Daniel Rall

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Josef Moeller » Fri, 22 Dec 2000 23:12:28




> > Although it is a tad outdated, yes, it is a good introduction to UN*X
> > kernel internals. OTOH I have also seen a book much like the Lion's,
> > based on Linux: "Linux Core Kernel Commentary" by Scott Maxwell
> > (CoriolisOpen Press, ISBN 1-57610-469-9). I have inherited the book from
> > a colleague who has left the department but, so far, I have not looked
> > through it, so I can't judge whether it is of any use.

> > Of course, Joe Humrickhouse's recommendations are good books, too.

> The "Linux Core Kernel Commentary" is interesting, but already sorely
> out of date.

Given the relative speed of development, any commented kernel source is
bound to be out of date.

--
Josef M?llers (Pinguinpfleger bei FSC)
        If failure had no penalty success would not be a prize (T.  Pratchett)

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Paul Repachol » Wed, 27 Dec 2000 00:54:08



> On Tue, 19 Dec 2000 12:38:15 +0800, Carfield Yim

> > From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
> > edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
> > system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
> > the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
> > that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
> > learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
> > experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
> > there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

> Try these:
> _The Design and Implementation of the 4.3BSD UNIX Operating System_ by
> Leffler, McKusick, Karels and Quarterman
> _Operating Systems Design and Implementation_ by Tanenbaum and
> Woodhall
> _The Design of the UNIX Operating System_, Bach

Try to also get some breadth into your readings. All Unix is
a very small part of the OS world view.

Hydra C.mmp. An experimental system. Wulf et al.
 Covers the hardware and software. Capabilities based system.

The IBM 360/370 papers. ( keep aspro handy while reading )

Trailing-egde.com has Tops-10 and TOPS-20. *e. Almost
ALL in Macro-10 and some BLISS. Tops-10 is older than ANY
unix, and was the first time-sharing OS sold.

If you can get them, the VMS Listing Fiche.

Also, the RSX kits have full kernel sources in them, with
comments. RSX is the 'base design' for VMS and NT.

Hang out in comp.os.research. Their FAQ has pointers to
research systems you can often download.

If you can find them, I hear the Burroughs kernel sources
are worth reading just for the humour.

--
Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,
+61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.
                                             West Australia 6076
Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.

 
 
 

Do "Lions' Commentary on UNIX" good for knowing unix kernal?

Post by Dichotimus Gro » Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:05:23


"Understanding the Linux Kernel"  --->
http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/linuxkernel/
- Daniel P. Bovet & Marco Cesati
ISBN 0-596-00002-2
O'Reilly Books - http://www.oreilly.com

Covers Linux Kernel version 2.2 quite well.

Alas ... if only the Linux Kernel Guru's knew how to document their designs
in the source :(
(They seem to think a comment is what I just made ... not something that
belongs in a .c file)


Quote:> From many classic review, the book "Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th
> edition : with source code " is the most excellent point of learn unix
> system. So I borrow it from my library, and then I find out that it is
> the source code with comment, as it state, but nothing more. Seen to me
> that it is a bit harder to read because I am a java programmer. Only
> learn C, ASM and Unix programming at college, with really less
> experience of these stuff. Do this book still suitable for me? or is
> there are better choice to learn more about Unix kernal?

 
 
 

1. "Lion's comment" and "minix"

Hi guys.

Now I am reading stevens' "Advanced Programming..."
And really want to write a simple kernel running on my pc if I can.
It will be very very tough but I think it will be the best way to know about
it

So what should I choose next if I have to?
1. Lions' Commentary on Unix
2. Minx books (I can't remember )
3. Hey!! Read more... ^^

And recommand some books for bootrap and loader.
I just know nothing but meaning of them.

Thanks for FUTURE answers!!!

2. Where to get HP drivers...

3. Need to move "unix.old" to "unix"!!!

4. Help! Mach64 Xconfig...

5. Is it "UNIX" or "Unix"?

6. intel lan card question

7. "Novell-like","non-TCP/IP","networking" OS to place Unix

8. No Sound!

9. """"""""My SoundBlast 16 pnp isn't up yet""""""""""""

10. Unix can't "see" my DOS partitions

11. the WinTroll formerly known as "Taylor" is now known as "GERRI"

12. The schizophrenic formerly known as "GERRI" is now known as "Depardeau"

13. The schizophrenic formerly known as "GERRI" is now known as "HHippo"