Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by Jeffrey J. Kosows » Fri, 04 Oct 2002 22:46:29



I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux but
occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system
(e.g. Dimension 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am
looking to spend ~$1500 not including monitor.

I have extensive hardward and software hobbyist experience, but want
advice on what to do here.

The following factors (if true) would lead me to favor building my
own. Please comment on whether they are true and significant
1. Significant price/performance advantage (> 10-20%)
2. Better Linux hardware compatibility
3. Better expandability/upgradeability (e.g., more PCI or memory slots))
4. Better quality
5. Availablity of good quality web reviews on how to choose and where
to buy "best" hardware (e.g., motherboard, video, sound)
6. Good, low-price stores or mail-order sites where I can buy multiple
components (I don't want to have to order from 10 different places)

All other things being equal, I would probably prefer to go with the
standard Dell since it will save time and hassle.

Thanks for your advice,
Jeff

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by John-Paul Stewar » Fri, 04 Oct 2002 23:33:42



> I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux but
> occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

> I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system
> (e.g. Dimension 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am
> looking to spend ~$1500 not including monitor.

> I have extensive hardward and software hobbyist experience, but want
> advice on what to do here.

> The following factors (if true) would lead me to favor building my
> own. Please comment on whether they are true and significant
> 1. Significant price/performance advantage (> 10-20%)

No.  Dell buys stuff in huge volumes and gets corresponding
discounts.  You don't.  But then Dell marks up those costs
to make their own profit.  In the end, you typically get the
same stuff at the same price when you build it yourself,
IME.  (If you're not careful when purchasing components the
home-built can actually cost more than a mass produced
machine.)

Quote:> 2. Better Linux hardware compatibility

This is possible because with the home built you can select
the motherboard, the modem, or whatever other components
might cause problems.  But you can usually find out from the
manufacturers website what chipsets they're using and sort
out compatability issues by choosing a Dell model that has a
Linux-supported chipset on the motherboard.

Quote:> 3. Better expandability/upgradeability (e.g., more PCI or memory slots))

It'll likely work out the same either way.

Quote:> 4. Better quality

If you choose high quality components for a home-built you
know what you're getting.  You don't necessarily know what
brand of hard drive (for instance) that Dell will be using
the day they build your system.  But generally Dells are
reasonably reliable.  And buying those high quality bits at
your local computer store will mean that the home built
could be (much) more expensive than the Dell.

Quote:> 5. Availablity of good quality web reviews on how to choose and where
> to buy "best" hardware (e.g., motherboard, video, sound)

"Best" is way too subjective.  What's best for the reviewer
may not be best for you.  Unless the reviewer makes his/her
criteria very clear and it is near-perfect match for your
needs, a review doesn't mean much.

Quote:> 6. Good, low-price stores or mail-order sites where I can buy multiple
> components (I don't want to have to order from 10 different places)

Shipping is always a killer on mail order.  And who know
when it'll arrive and in what condition.  At least with a
Dell system they'll tell you when it'll ship and it'll
arrive on time, in good condition, and with a warranty.

Quote:> All other things being equal, I would probably prefer to go with the
> standard Dell since it will save time and hassle.

Generally, I recommend people only build from scratch when
they have specific requirements that cannot be met by other
systems.  One thing I dislike about home built systems is
the lack of a single warranty contact.  It is up to you to
figure out which component went bad, then ascertain whether
or not it covered by a warranty and who to contact for
replacement/repair.  With Dells and other similar systems,
you just call Dell and let them deal with it.

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by Chris Co » Sat, 05 Oct 2002 05:39:35



> I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux but
> occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

> I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system
> (e.g. Dimension 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am
> looking to spend ~$1500 not including monitor.

> I have extensive hardward and software hobbyist experience, but want
> advice on what to do here.

> The following factors (if true) would lead me to favor building my
> own. Please comment on whether they are true and significant
> 1. Significant price/performance advantage (> 10-20%)
> 2. Better Linux hardware compatibility
> 3. Better expandability/upgradeability (e.g., more PCI or memory slots))
> 4. Better quality
> 5. Availablity of good quality web reviews on how to choose and where
> to buy "best" hardware (e.g., motherboard, video, sound)
> 6. Good, low-price stores or mail-order sites where I can buy multiple
> components (I don't want to have to order from 10 different places)

> All other things being equal, I would probably prefer to go with the
> standard Dell since it will save time and hassle.

> Thanks for your advice,
> Jeff

wwww.monarchcomputer.com
On a budget.. go with dual MP1900+ on a K7D Master-L
 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by Mark Carrol » Sat, 05 Oct 2002 06:59:52




(snip)

Quote:>www.monarchcomputer.com
>On a budget.. go with dual MP1900+ on a K7D Master-L

FWIW, I just bought from them and am very happy with the results - I
built a dual MP2000+ on a Tiger MP board and Linux seems quite happy
with it - the kernel config was easy.

-- Mark

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by rcarte » Sat, 05 Oct 2002 08:45:16




Quote:

> I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux but
> occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

> I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system
> (e.g. Dimension 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am
> looking to spend ~$1500 not including monitor.

> I have extensive hardward and software hobbyist experience, but want
> advice on what to do here.

> The following factors (if true) would lead me to favor building my
> own. Please comment on whether they are true and significant
> 1. Significant price/performance advantage (> 10-20%)
> 2. Better Linux hardware compatibility
> 3. Better expandability/upgradeability (e.g., more PCI or memory slots))
> 4. Better quality
> 5. Availablity of good quality web reviews on how to choose and where
> to buy "best" hardware (e.g., motherboard, video, sound)
> 6. Good, low-price stores or mail-order sites where I can buy multiple
> components (I don't want to have to order from 10 different places)

> All other things being equal, I would probably prefer to go with the
> standard Dell since it will save time and hassle.

> Thanks for your advice,
> Jeff

You can't really save anything by building a system anymore. I suggest you
look at: techbroker, googlegear and walmart.
 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by B. Joshua Rose » Sat, 05 Oct 2002 10:16:57



Quote:> I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux but
> occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

> I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system (e.g. Dimension
> 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am looking to spend ~$1500
> not including monitor.

> I have extensive hardward and software hobbyist experience, but want
> advice on what to do here.

> The following factors (if true) would lead me to favor building my own.
> Please comment on whether they are true and significant 1. Significant
> price/performance advantage (> 10-20%) 2. Better Linux hardware
> compatibility 3. Better expandability/upgradeability (e.g., more PCI or
> memory slots)) 4. Better quality
> 5. Availablity of good quality web reviews on how to choose and where to
> buy "best" hardware (e.g., motherboard, video, sound) 6. Good, low-price
> stores or mail-order sites where I can buy multiple components (I don't
> want to have to order from 10 different places)

> All other things being equal, I would probably prefer to go with the
> standard Dell since it will save time and hassle.

> Thanks for your advice,
> Jeff

If you want an Intel System with Windows XP and Office XP then Dell is
the way to go, if you want the fastest Linux system for the money then
build your own Athlon XP system. Dell is an Intel only shop and they
force you to buy Windoze on everything except servers so even with Dell's
lower cost you end up paying a little more because of the Windows tax.

Give these guys a look for a fully customized box

http://www.accessmicro.com/bto/index.phtml?kitid=KTAXPDDR333#products

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by Andrew Heco » Sun, 06 Oct 2002 03:34:33


Totally inaccurate.

Price yourself a $1500 Dell than try and build the components yourself . . .
I doubt you'll cross $900.

The case where the below statement is close to true is for the very very
very low-end cheap entry level pcs on sale . . .



> > I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux but
> > occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

> > I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system
> > (e.g. Dimension 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am
> > looking to spend ~$1500 not including monitor.

> > I have extensive hardward and software hobbyist experience, but want
> > advice on what to do here.

> > The following factors (if true) would lead me to favor building my
> > own. Please comment on whether they are true and significant
> > 1. Significant price/performance advantage (> 10-20%)

> No.  Dell buys stuff in huge volumes and gets corresponding
> discounts.  You don't.  But then Dell marks up those costs
> to make their own profit.  In the end, you typically get the
> same stuff at the same price when you build it yourself,
> IME.  (If you're not careful when purchasing components the
> home-built can actually cost more than a mass produced
> machine.)

> > 2. Better Linux hardware compatibility

> This is possible because with the home built you can select
> the motherboard, the modem, or whatever other components
> might cause problems.  But you can usually find out from the
> manufacturers website what chipsets they're using and sort
> out compatability issues by choosing a Dell model that has a
> Linux-supported chipset on the motherboard.

> > 3. Better expandability/upgradeability (e.g., more PCI or memory slots))

> It'll likely work out the same either way.

> > 4. Better quality

> If you choose high quality components for a home-built you
> know what you're getting.  You don't necessarily know what
> brand of hard drive (for instance) that Dell will be using
> the day they build your system.  But generally Dells are
> reasonably reliable.  And buying those high quality bits at
> your local computer store will mean that the home built
> could be (much) more expensive than the Dell.

> > 5. Availablity of good quality web reviews on how to choose and where
> > to buy "best" hardware (e.g., motherboard, video, sound)

> "Best" is way too subjective.  What's best for the reviewer
> may not be best for you.  Unless the reviewer makes his/her
> criteria very clear and it is near-perfect match for your
> needs, a review doesn't mean much.

> > 6. Good, low-price stores or mail-order sites where I can buy multiple
> > components (I don't want to have to order from 10 different places)

> Shipping is always a killer on mail order.  And who know
> when it'll arrive and in what condition.  At least with a
> Dell system they'll tell you when it'll ship and it'll
> arrive on time, in good condition, and with a warranty.

> > All other things being equal, I would probably prefer to go with the
> > standard Dell since it will save time and hassle.

> Generally, I recommend people only build from scratch when
> they have specific requirements that cannot be met by other
> systems.  One thing I dislike about home built systems is
> the lack of a single warranty contact.  It is up to you to
> figure out which component went bad, then ascertain whether
> or not it covered by a warranty and who to contact for
> replacement/repair.  With Dells and other similar systems,
> you just call Dell and let them deal with it.

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by John-Paul Stewar » Sun, 06 Oct 2002 06:16:56


[Please don't top post.  Message re-arranged to comply with
Usenet conventions.]





> > > I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux but
> > > occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

> > > I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system
> > > (e.g. Dimension 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am
> > > looking to spend ~$1500 not including monitor.

> > > I have extensive hardward and software hobbyist experience, but want
> > > advice on what to do here.

> > > The following factors (if true) would lead me to favor building my
> > > own. Please comment on whether they are true and significant
> > > 1. Significant price/performance advantage (> 10-20%)

> > No.  Dell buys stuff in huge volumes and gets corresponding
> > discounts.  You don't.  But then Dell marks up those costs
> > to make their own profit.  In the end, you typically get the
> > same stuff at the same price when you build it yourself,
> > IME.  (If you're not careful when purchasing components the
> > home-built can actually cost more than a mass produced
> > machine.)

> > > 2. Better Linux hardware compatibility

> > This is possible because with the home built you can select
> > the motherboard, the modem, or whatever other components
> > might cause problems.  But you can usually find out from the
> > manufacturers website what chipsets they're using and sort
> > out compatability issues by choosing a Dell model that has a
> > Linux-supported chipset on the motherboard.

> > > 3. Better expandability/upgradeability (e.g., more PCI or memory slots))

> > It'll likely work out the same either way.

> > > 4. Better quality

> > If you choose high quality components for a home-built you
> > know what you're getting.  You don't necessarily know what
> > brand of hard drive (for instance) that Dell will be using
> > the day they build your system.  But generally Dells are
> > reasonably reliable.  And buying those high quality bits at
> > your local computer store will mean that the home built
> > could be (much) more expensive than the Dell.

> > > 5. Availablity of good quality web reviews on how to choose and where
> > > to buy "best" hardware (e.g., motherboard, video, sound)

> > "Best" is way too subjective.  What's best for the reviewer
> > may not be best for you.  Unless the reviewer makes his/her
> > criteria very clear and it is near-perfect match for your
> > needs, a review doesn't mean much.

> > > 6. Good, low-price stores or mail-order sites where I can buy multiple
> > > components (I don't want to have to order from 10 different places)

> > Shipping is always a killer on mail order.  And who know
> > when it'll arrive and in what condition.  At least with a
> > Dell system they'll tell you when it'll ship and it'll
> > arrive on time, in good condition, and with a warranty.

> > > All other things being equal, I would probably prefer to go with the
> > > standard Dell since it will save time and hassle.

> > Generally, I recommend people only build from scratch when
> > they have specific requirements that cannot be met by other
> > systems.  One thing I dislike about home built systems is
> > the lack of a single warranty contact.  It is up to you to
> > figure out which component went bad, then ascertain whether
> > or not it covered by a warranty and who to contact for
> > replacement/repair.  With Dells and other similar systems,
> > you just call Dell and let them deal with it.

> Totally inaccurate.

> Price yourself a $1500 Dell than try and build the components yourself . . .
> I doubt you'll cross $900.

My above statements were made on the basis of an upgarde I
did a couple of months ago.  What is your frame of reference
for saying they are "totally inaccurate"?

At that time I bought some new components (and spent a day
and a half of time buying and assembling them) and re-used
some bits (CD-ROM, monitor, etc.) to put together a new
system.  Less than a week later, I found a comparable Dell
system (_including_ a 15" monitor, new CD-ROM, etc.) for
about the same price.

Quote:> The case where the below statement is close to true is for the very very
> very low-end cheap entry level pcs on sale . . .

Then your experiences are quite different from mine.  I've
found that buying quality components and assembling a system
is about the same cost as buying a pre-built one.
 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by Robert E A Harv » Sun, 06 Oct 2002 12:36:25



> wwww.monarchcomputer.com
> On a budget.. go with dual MP1900+ on a K7D Master-L

I've just built such a system, using two XP1700 and some conductive
paint...
I am very pleased with it, and have no plans to install gatesware at
all.

The plug-in usb board looses you a slot, but what the hell, it has
lots of slots, and the plug-in is USB2.  I am very pleased with my
motherboard.

The only thing that didn't work "out of the box" with SuSE 7.2 was the
on-board sound, and I learned a huge amount about linux sound systems
by downloading the very latest alsa and compiling it.  In fact I now
have on-board sound AND a soundblaster platinum with 5.1 speakers.

I've kept a diary about the project, which I will mail to anyone who
contacts me on bobharvey {curly thing} europe {spot thing} com

by purchasing "special offers" and "today only" I kept the price of
the whole thing to about 450 UKP not including the screen - because I
havn't got one yet, it's a hermit crab - and the soundblaster.

Biggest job was fitting a second fan to the budget 400W PSU I bought
for 17 of your british monetary units.  Made a huge difference to
airflow and processor temperature.

I can also commend the AMD web site - it has a lot of really useful
stuff about building systems, sensible choices of motherboard, power
supply & cooling selection, etc.

The other thing I hanker after is a shuttle SS40 - but there are
"issues" with the SIS chipset and linux at the moment, I hear, so if I
wait there may be an AMD version with the AGP graphics slot.

I reckon I could have built a single CPU 2000 system for under 375
GBP, including DVDrom but not monitor.  A colleague who watched me
build this one has gone back to the states to do the same. - he is
going to buy the dual mother board and put one CPU in it, then add the
2nd when he can afford it.  Nice plan that as well.  He has a copy of
slackware he wants to put on it.

The only thing that annoys me is the cost of cases: you can get a
basic one with 250W PSU for 30 quid - or a brilliant one with no psu
for over a hundred.  There is nothing in the middle, around the 50
beer token sort of price.  Although that said, SUntek in Germany do a
rather spiffy looking case with a translucent cover, and matching
keyboard and mouse....http://www.suntek-case.de/en/index.html

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by Andrew Heco » Wed, 09 Oct 2002 04:42:40



> [Please don't top post.  Message re-arranged to comply with
> Usenet conventions.]





> > > > I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux
but
> > > > occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

> > > > I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system
> > > > (e.g. Dimension 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am
> > > > looking to spend ~$1500 not including monitor.

> > > > I have extensive hardward and software hobbyist experience, but want
> > > > advice on what to do here.

> > > > The following factors (if true) would lead me to favor building my
> > > > own. Please comment on whether they are true and significant
> > > > 1. Significant price/performance advantage (> 10-20%)

> > > No.  Dell buys stuff in huge volumes and gets corresponding
> > > discounts.  You don't.  But then Dell marks up those costs
> > > to make their own profit.  In the end, you typically get the
> > > same stuff at the same price when you build it yourself,
> > > IME.  (If you're not careful when purchasing components the
> > > home-built can actually cost more than a mass produced
> > > machine.)

> > > > 2. Better Linux hardware compatibility

> > > This is possible because with the home built you can select
> > > the motherboard, the modem, or whatever other components
> > > might cause problems.  But you can usually find out from the
> > > manufacturers website what chipsets they're using and sort
> > > out compatability issues by choosing a Dell model that has a
> > > Linux-supported chipset on the motherboard.

> > > > 3. Better expandability/upgradeability (e.g., more PCI or memory
slots))

> > > It'll likely work out the same either way.

> > > > 4. Better quality

> > > If you choose high quality components for a home-built you
> > > know what you're getting.  You don't necessarily know what
> > > brand of hard drive (for instance) that Dell will be using
> > > the day they build your system.  But generally Dells are
> > > reasonably reliable.  And buying those high quality bits at
> > > your local computer store will mean that the home built
> > > could be (much) more expensive than the Dell.

> > > > 5. Availablity of good quality web reviews on how to choose and
where
> > > > to buy "best" hardware (e.g., motherboard, video, sound)

> > > "Best" is way too subjective.  What's best for the reviewer
> > > may not be best for you.  Unless the reviewer makes his/her
> > > criteria very clear and it is near-perfect match for your
> > > needs, a review doesn't mean much.

> > > > 6. Good, low-price stores or mail-order sites where I can buy
multiple
> > > > components (I don't want to have to order from 10 different places)

> > > Shipping is always a killer on mail order.  And who know
> > > when it'll arrive and in what condition.  At least with a
> > > Dell system they'll tell you when it'll ship and it'll
> > > arrive on time, in good condition, and with a warranty.

> > > > All other things being equal, I would probably prefer to go with the
> > > > standard Dell since it will save time and hassle.

> > > Generally, I recommend people only build from scratch when
> > > they have specific requirements that cannot be met by other
> > > systems.  One thing I dislike about home built systems is
> > > the lack of a single warranty contact.  It is up to you to
> > > figure out which component went bad, then ascertain whether
> > > or not it covered by a warranty and who to contact for
> > > replacement/repair.  With Dells and other similar systems,
> > > you just call Dell and let them deal with it.

> > Totally inaccurate.

> > Price yourself a $1500 Dell than try and build the components yourself .
. .
> > I doubt you'll cross $900.

> My above statements were made on the basis of an upgarde I
> did a couple of months ago.  What is your frame of reference
> for saying they are "totally inaccurate"?

> At that time I bought some new components (and spent a day
> and a half of time buying and assembling them) and re-used
> some bits (CD-ROM, monitor, etc.) to put together a new
> system.  Less than a week later, I found a comparable Dell
> system (_including_ a 15" monitor, new CD-ROM, etc.) for
> about the same price.

> > The case where the below statement is close to true is for the very very
> > very low-end cheap entry level pcs on sale . . .

> Then your experiences are quite different from mine.  I've
> found that buying quality components and assembling a system
> is about the same cost as buying a pre-built one.

My apologies about the earlier top-post ;)

My experience is both as a home-builder and also a pc tech.

I had a hard time landing right on the $1500 mark, but built this system at
$1589, which  already includes the accompanying $100 rebate.

Anyway, the key parts of the dell

p4 2.53
512 rdram
533 fsb mb w/ agp & 5 pci
80 mb IDE ATA100 HD
DVD x16
CD-RW 40x10x10
Floppy
PCI NIC
PCI Modem
Radeon 9000 128 mg video card

building

p4 2.53 = $230
512 RDRAM (2 256mb) = $160
533 (abit Part - 6641) = $94
80 mb (WD SE, surperior to dell's) = 106
DVD x 16 = $10
CD-RW 40x10x40 = $46
Floppy = $8
NIC (integrated)
PCI Modem = $8
Radeon 9000 128mg Video card $86

all prices include maximum shipping and were grabbed from pricewatch.com

bring out the old calculator . .  .

gives me $1589 versus $648

quite a savings!

the Dell price was with a 1 year warranty while all of the individual parts
listed have at least a 1 year warranty

AH

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by John-Paul Stewar » Wed, 09 Oct 2002 23:57:49






> > > The case where the below statement is close to true is for the very very
> > > very low-end cheap entry level pcs on sale . . .

> > Then your experiences are quite different from mine.  I've
> > found that buying quality components and assembling a system
> > is about the same cost as buying a pre-built one.

> My experience is both as a home-builder and also a pc tech.

> I had a hard time landing right on the $1500 mark, but built this system at
> $1589, which  already includes the accompanying $100 rebate.

> Anyway, the key parts of the dell

> p4 2.53
> 512 rdram
> 533 fsb mb w/ agp & 5 pci
> 80 mb IDE ATA100 HD
> DVD x16
> CD-RW 40x10x10
> Floppy
> PCI NIC
> PCI Modem
> Radeon 9000 128 mg video card

> building

> p4 2.53 = $230
> 512 RDRAM (2 256mb) = $160
> 533 (abit Part - 6641) = $94
> 80 mb (WD SE, surperior to dell's) = 106
> DVD x 16 = $10
> CD-RW 40x10x40 = $46
> Floppy = $8
> NIC (integrated)
> PCI Modem = $8
> Radeon 9000 128mg Video card $86

> all prices include maximum shipping and were grabbed from pricewatch.com

I'm really skeptical of those prices.  Clearly they are all
for OEM versions of the products, not retail.  That always
means shorter warranties.  

Those prices are also _hugely_ out of line with what I can
find at my local shops.  Around here the prices for CPU,
RAM, CD-RW and the Radeon 9000 are twice what you quoted.
The DVD, floppy drive, and modem much more than twice those
prices.  The hard drive an mother board prices are in about
the same ballpark, though.

Quote:> bring out the old calculator . .  .

> gives me $1589 versus $648

You omitted case, power supply, mouse, keyboard, all of
which are included from Dell.  Admittedly that's only
another $100 or so.

Quote:> quite a savings!

> the Dell price was with a 1 year warranty while all of the individual parts
> listed have at least a 1 year warranty

In the end, it appears that computer prices are heavily
dependent upon geography.  If you can actually get the
pricewatch prices, then it may make sense.
 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by ERA » Thu, 10 Oct 2002 00:41:43



Quote:

> I am about to buy a new computer that I will mostly use for Linux
> but occassionally will need to run Windoze for work and games

> I am deciding between buying a standard Dell-type system
> (e.g. Dimension 8200) vs. building my own from components. I am
> looking to spend ~$1500 not including monitor.

[...]

Jeff,

My company custom builds PCs to spec and will preload Linux and leave
space on the drive for That Other OS. You would have to find
somewhere else to buy your Windoze as we no longer sell M$ product.
If you would be interested in a quote then write me at:


 subject: Linux PC Quote Request

and include the exact specifications for your PC. I do recommend all
SCSI for true multitasking OSs like *n?x OSs. I'm pretty sure we can
build you an all SCSI box for around $1500.

If you really don't want to try that then I suggest looking at
http://www.googlegear.com/ for your hardware to build your own
system. I have used them myself when I could not get a part from our
distributors and found the pricing to be quite good.

As for the buy a Dell vs. "roll yer own" question I'd say get a Dell
if you find a deal that meets your spec since Dell does preload
'doze. You can always reorganize the partitions with a partition
manager like Partition Magic and add Linux to the box. Of course if
you "roll yer own" then you can pick exactly what goes in it (hmm,
much like buying from us ;-) instead of having to get whatever parts
Dell got cheapest this week.


SCO Group Authorized Partner - OpenServer, UnixWare & SCO Linux
--
Linux era1.eracc.UUCP 2.4.13 i686
 10:08am  up 12 days, 17:04,  4 users,  load average: 0.07, 0.11, 0.09
ERA Computer Consulting http://eracc.hypermart.net/
eCS, OS/2, Linux, OpenServer, UnixWare, SCO Linux resellers

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by Jeffrey J. Kosows » Thu, 10 Oct 2002 01:39:38



> I had a hard time landing right on the $1500 mark, but built this system at
> $1589, which  already includes the accompanying $100 rebate.

> Anyway, the key parts of the dell

> p4 2.53
> 512 rdram
> 533 fsb mb w/ agp & 5 pci
> 80 mb IDE ATA100 HD
> DVD x16
> CD-RW 40x10x10
> Floppy
> PCI NIC
> PCI Modem
> Radeon 9000 128 mg video card

> building

> p4 2.53 = $230
> 512 RDRAM (2 256mb) = $160
> 533 (abit Part - 6641) = $94
> 80 mb (WD SE, surperior to dell's) = 106
> DVD x 16 = $10
> CD-RW 40x10x40 = $46
> Floppy = $8
> NIC (integrated)
> PCI Modem = $8
> Radeon 9000 128mg Video card $86

> all prices include maximum shipping and were grabbed from pricewatch.com
> gives me $1589 versus $648
> quite a savings!

Did you have to order from half a dozen different vendors (a real
hassle) or could you find one or two shops that would provide all the
above?

I would love to replicate it.

 
 
 

Help deciding "Make vs. Buy" for new dual-boot Linux-Win system

Post by Andrew Heco » Thu, 10 Oct 2002 03:22:38



> > I had a hard time landing right on the $1500

mark, but built this system at
Quote:> > $1589, which  already includes the

accompanying $100 rebate.
Quote:

> > Anyway, the key parts of the dell

> > p4 2.53
> > 512 rdram
> > 533 fsb mb w/ agp & 5 pci
> > 80 mb IDE ATA100 HD
> > DVD x16
> > CD-RW 40x10x10
> > Floppy
> > PCI NIC
> > PCI Modem
> > Radeon 9000 128 mg video card

> > building

> > p4 2.53 = $230
> > 512 RDRAM (2 256mb) = $160
> > 533 (abit Part - 6641) = $94
> > 80 mb (WD SE, surperior to dell's) = 106
> > DVD x 16 = $10
> > CD-RW 40x10x40 = $46
> > Floppy = $8
> > NIC (integrated)
> > PCI Modem = $8
> > Radeon 9000 128mg Video card $86

> > all prices include maximum shipping and were

grabbed from pricewatch.com
Quote:

> > gives me $1589 versus $648
> > quite a savings!

> Did you have to order from half a dozen

different vendors (a real
Quote:> hassle) or could you find one or two shops that

would provide all the

Quote:> above?

> I would love to replicate it.

I shopped via pricewatch.com and didn't pay too
much attention to how many of the sites were
similar.  A quick run at newegg (a very good site
with great a great reliability history, which you
can check at resellerratings.com) gives me:

P4 2.53- $241
512 RDRAM- $250
i850E based MB (RDRAM & 533 FSB)- 143
80 MB WD SE HD- $109
DVD x16- $40
CD-RW 32x10x40- $45
Floppy- $8
NIC- integrated
PCI Modem- $10
Radeon 9000 128- $87

note, from earlier post- on both the Dell and the
system I built, I left off the monitor, for which
Dell was charging $160 for a 17th CRT (which costs
about $50) but I didn't feel like shopping for
monitors.  The Dell did include keyboard and
mouse, which I did not include.

So by shopping at one store, you add a bit,
notably on the RAM, Motherboard, and DVD drive.
The RAM I'd get elsewhere and I'd just pick up a
DVD ROM on sale (as they are just about everyweek)
at some area computer store.  I got mine, on sale,
for $16, and I see similar deals just about every
weekend.

Ignoring those three components (assuming you
shopped for them indepently), it'd cost you $16
more to get all the parts at newegg, plus I think
the floppy might have had shipping costs (the rest
were free).

The point is that even if you included all parts
from newegg, you're still at about half of what
Dell is charging.  Dell is a fine company, but
definately not the best deal in town.  No company
that pays loads of money for national advertising
campaigns and has stock holders who want profits
are going to be the best solution, they are just
the best business in their sector.  That doesn't
mean it's who you want to buy YOUR system from.

 
 
 

1. RedHat 5.2, "/boot/System.map" and "/boot/System.map"

Hello,

Would someone know how to configure  modules with the
"/boot/System.map"  and  "/boot/System.map" files in RedHat 5.2?
I can't seem to find any references on the RedHat site to these files.
In 5.1 all you had to do was rename your kernel with a name like
"vmlinuz-2.0.35.x" and an accompanying modules directory called
"/lib/modules/2.0.35.x" and the modules were loaded properly.  It took
me awhile to figure that one out...and RedHat goes and changes the rules
again ;-\

Thanks, Luc.

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