Very Computer

by **Neil Bir** » Fri, 17 Dec 1999 04:00:00

I've just got a spanking new Ultra5 with 24-bit graphics, using
Sparc/Solaris 2.6.

However, one of our apps. insists on PseudoColor colourmaps (for full
colourmap control), and this doesn't run with the xserver in 24bpp mode as
it only services a single TrueColor visual.

How can I run up the xserver with support for /both/ visuals, or maybe
add a PsuedoColor visual before running the app.?

Or can't I?

[when I used Exceed for a bit, it had a massive wad of visuals, all
concurrently available. I'd hope that Sun's could do the same]

--
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=====================- http://www.racaldefence.com/ -===================
Neil Bird | This is who we are The time is near
|

by **Kjetil Torgrim Homm** » Sat, 18 Dec 1999 04:00:00

[Neil Bird]

Quote:> How can I run up the xserver with support for /both/ visuals, or
> maybe add a PsuedoColor visual before running the app.?

> Or can't I?

It depends on your graphics card. If it was possible (== without
performance penalties), Xsun would have done so.

Quote:> [when I used Exceed for a bit, it had a massive wad of visuals,
> all concurrently available. I'd hope that Sun's could do the same]

Interesting. What graphics card was that?

Kjetil T.

by **Casper H.S. Dik - Network Security Engine** » Sat, 18 Dec 1999 04:00:00

[[ PLEASE DON'T SEND ME EMAIL COPIES OF POSTINGS ]]

> However, one of our apps. insists on PseudoColor colourmaps (for full
>colourmap control), and this doesn't run with the xserver in 24bpp mode as
>it only services a single TrueColor visual.
> How can I run up the xserver with support for /both/ visuals, or maybe
>add a PsuedoColor visual before running the app.?

The PGX24 cannot do this; other Sun systems can do this by virtue of having
a 32 bit display (24 bit truecolor + 8 bit Pseudo color overlay)

Casper
--
Expressed in this posting are my opinions. They are in no way related
to opinions held by my employer, Sun Microsystems.
Statements on Sun products included here are not gospel and may
be fiction rather than truth.

by **Neil Bir** » Sat, 18 Dec 1999 04:00:00

> [Neil Bird]
> > How can I run up the xserver with support for /both/ visuals, or
> > maybe add a PsuedoColor visual before running the app.?
> It depends on your graphics card. If it was possible (== without
> performance penalties), Xsun would have done so.

Hmm. That's a bit af a downer. It means I'll have to run permanently in
8bpp mode, just for the one app. :-(

Quote:> > [when I used Exceed for a bit, it had a massive wad of visuals,
> > all concurrently available. I'd hope that Sun's could do the same]
> Interesting. What graphics card was that?

Beats me, although I don't think it's relevant. I ran Exceed on the
PeeCee on my desk, and when I ran an xterm on my sun, displaying under
Exceed, xdpyinfo reported a slew of visuals.

This meant, for example, that my problem app. ran when it asked for it's
own PsudoColor visual/colormap, and also Netscape could display 24bpp
graphics alongside it, with no horrible colormap flashing.

--
Please replace 'rdel.nspam' with 'rdel.co.uk' to reply.
=====================- http://www.racaldefence.com/ -===================
Neil Bird | This is who we are The time is near
|

by **Alan Stang** » Sat, 18 Dec 1999 04:00:00

I seem to recall some additional features for the X server in one of the
Solaris 7 releases (5/99, 11/99, etc), such that the Xserver would mimic
a pseudo-color colormap on top of the usual TrueColor visual. I poked
around on SunSolve in the info-express area, but I can't find the
original article.

Needless to say, any program that can't handle one of the available
visuals (especially TrueColor) is basically broken. And there are a lot
of older X programs that are broken in this way.

--

by **Drazen Kac** » Mon, 20 Dec 1999 04:00:00

> > The PGX24 cannot do this; other Sun systems can do this by virtue of having
> > a 32 bit display (24 bit truecolor + 8 bit Pseudo color overlay)

> If it can be done, what is the process to enable it on my Xserver?
> I've never been able to figure it out on either my S20/SX or my Creator
> graphics so I always run at 24bit. I have some 8bit apps I'd love to
> see run along side my 24 bit ones but they don't work....

It's enabled by default. If you look at xdpyinfo output, you'll see a
bunch of visuals on Creator. Your 8bpp apps probably don't know how
to select 8bpp visual (which is rather easy to code). Try to find a command
switch in the manual which would make them use non-default visual
and then give them 8bpp PseudoColor. But the chances are thin; if an
application can work only in 8bpp and it can't select 8bpp visual by itself,
then it probably expects that the default visual is 8bpp and has no way to
use non-default one. That's a very buggy application.

--
.-. .-. I don't work for my employer.
(_ \ / _)

by **Casper H.S. Dik - Network Security Engine** » Mon, 20 Dec 1999 04:00:00

[[ PLEASE DON'T SEND ME EMAIL COPIES OF POSTINGS ]]

>If it can be done, what is the process to enable it on my Xserver?
>I've never been able to figure it out on either my S20/SX or my Creator graphics
>so I always run at 24bit. I have some 8bit apps I'd love to
>see run along side my 24 bit ones but they don't work....

There are a few different colormap problems you'll find; they don't
stop when you can run 24 and 8 bit apps on teh same display.

A quick check to see if you can is "xdpyinfo"

One problem you may face when using a default depth of 24 is that
some applications will assume 8bit and will fail to run rather than
picking a proper visual.

When running 8 bit default, some color hungry applications will
use an 8 bit visual as well, rather than picking a proper 24 bit
visual which would suit them better.

So the problem isn't really the depth of your display but
the brokeness of X applications; many are broken.

Casper
--
Expressed in this posting are my opinions. They are in no way related
to opinions held by my employer, Sun Microsystems.
Statements on Sun products included here are not gospel and may
be fiction rather than truth.

by **Tom Leitne** » Mon, 20 Dec 1999 04:00:00

> [[ PLEASE DON'T SEND ME EMAIL COPIES OF POSTINGS ]]

> So the problem isn't really the depth of your display but
> the brokeness of X applications; many are broken.

I second that. However, there's a big lack in visual support on almost
all Suns I've came across: There's no TrueColor, depth 16 visual available
in the Creator graphics card series. In my opinion, this visual type has the
best tradeoff between the number of colors and the memory required by
applications.

Consider this: Our application requires lots of huge (up to full-screen)
Pixmaps for animation purposes. Some users even have our application
running on all four CDE desktops. One of our customers recently upgraded
30+ Suns from old Sparc 5 w/ 128MB RAM to Ultra 10 boxes with 256MB RAM
and Creator 3D cards. Previously, our app. was running with PseudoColor
visuals, now the new machines are already running on their limits again
because our app. uses the fancy TrueColor 24 bit visuals and thus requires
lots of RAM, much more RAM than 16-bit visuals (I'm using on my Tru64
development machine) would require.

Our app. is well behaved. It can use all sorts of available visuals
and choses the best visual from the list of available visuals. Environment
variables can be used to influence this. Now I could force our app. to
use the 8-bit PseudoColor visual which is additionally available to the
24-bit TrueColor. But this limits the number of simultaneous apps. which
can be run without color-flashing and I want to leave the PseudoColor
visual free for other legacy (to use this new buzzword) apps.

So the situation is not very satisfactory: They have these shiny new
boxes and invested lots of money, but our app. is still not as fast
as it could be, just because there are not 16-bit TrueColor visuals
available.

Comments?

Tom
--
Dr. Tom Leitner Dept. of Communications, Graz Univ. of Technology,

by **Cameron Simpso** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

| I've just got a spanking new Ultra5 with 24-bit graphics, using
| Sparc/Solaris 2.6.
| However, one of our apps. insists on PseudoColor colourmaps (for full
| colourmap control), and this doesn't run with the xserver in 24bpp mode as
| it only services a single TrueColor visual.
| How can I run up the xserver with support for /both/ visuals, or maybe
| add a PsuedoColor visual before running the app.?
| Or can't I?

Some (most? dunno) Sun framebuffer will support both (they should
appear in the visual list of xdpyinfo I'd expect if available).

But if not, get vnc from
http://www.uk.research.att.com/vnc/
and fire up an 8-bit deep vncserver and view it on your 24 bit display
with vncviewer; you then p[oint the $DISPLAY for your app at the 8-bit
deep vnc server. A tad cumbersome, but saves you from abandoning 24 bit
colour for 8 bit pseudo-colour.

Cheers,
--

by **John Riddoc** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

> | I've just got a spanking new Ultra5 with 24-bit graphics, using
> | Sparc/Solaris 2.6.
> | However, one of our apps. insists on PseudoColor colourmaps (for full
> | colourmap control), and this doesn't run with the xserver in 24bpp mode as
> | it only services a single TrueColor visual.
> | How can I run up the xserver with support for /both/ visuals, or maybe
> | add a PsuedoColor visual before running the app.?
> | Or can't I?

> Some (most? dunno) Sun framebuffer will support both (they should
> appear in the visual list of xdpyinfo I'd expect if available).

Only newer versions of X under Solaris 7 do this; patches should be available
to allow it for earlier versions. For XFree86, the upcoming 4.0 release
should perform a similar function.

--

http://www.scms.rgu.ac.uk/staff/jr/
First Law of Socio-Genetics:
Celibacy is not hereditary.

Very Computer

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?

Very Computer

Use both TrueColor *and* PseudoColor?

Use both TrueColor and PseudoColor?