Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by siv » Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:16:23



I am looking for Solaris9 volume manager vs Veritas volume manager
technical comparison document. Any inputs or document links are
welcome.
Solaris9 has ODS (open disk suite) Volume manager which comes free.
Why should pay for Veritas ??
 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Ben Taylo » Fri, 28 Feb 2003 11:06:43



> I am looking for Solaris9 volume manager vs Veritas volume manager
> technical comparison document. Any inputs or document links are
> welcome.
> Solaris9 has ODS (open disk suite) Volume manager which comes free.
> Why should pay for Veritas ??

1) IIRC, VxFS only works with VxVM
2) VxVM has the capability to decrease the size of a volume on the fly
3) The GUI is definitely more functional
4) Layered volumes (1+0), though SDS does act like this when you have
    0+1 with exactly the same size partitions of each slice.
5) Familarity with VxVM vs SDS

To name a few.

Ben

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Chris Co » Fri, 28 Feb 2003 13:47:14




>> I am looking for Solaris9 volume manager vs Veritas volume manager
>> technical comparison document. Any inputs or document links are
>> welcome.
>> Solaris9 has ODS (open disk suite) Volume manager which comes free.
>> Why should pay for Veritas ??

> 1) IIRC, VxFS only works with VxVM
> 2) VxVM has the capability to decrease the size of a volume on the fly
> 3) The GUI is definitely more functional
> 4) Layered volumes (1+0), though SDS does act like this when you have
>    0+1 with exactly the same size partitions of each slice.
> 5) Familarity with VxVM vs SDS

> To name a few.

Also... (not totally sure), but I believe only VxM can be used
in a Sun Cluster (shared drive).  Which is interesting when you
think about it.
 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Ben Taylo » Fri, 28 Feb 2003 14:54:42





>>> I am looking for Solaris9 volume manager vs Veritas volume manager
>>> technical comparison document. Any inputs or document links are
>>> welcome.
>>> Solaris9 has ODS (open disk suite) Volume manager which comes free.
>>> Why should pay for Veritas ??

>> 1) IIRC, VxFS only works with VxVM
>> 2) VxVM has the capability to decrease the size of a volume on the fly
>> 3) The GUI is definitely more functional
>> 4) Layered volumes (1+0), though SDS does act like this when you have
>>    0+1 with exactly the same size partitions of each slice.
>> 5) Familarity with VxVM vs SDS

>> To name a few.

> Also... (not totally sure), but I believe only VxM can be used
> in a Sun Cluster (shared drive).  Which is interesting when you
> think about it.

Nope. SDS was the original volume manager of choice.  It was late in
the development game before Sun actually got VxVM working in the
SC3.0 configs.

SDS uses the concept of a metaset (as opposed to a metadevice) which
allows the cluster to use a shared file system.  It's basically the
same as a metadevice, but has the benefit of sharing between systems.
If you're not using cluster, but trying to do a shared file system,
you can use metaset -s <setname> -t to take control of a shared
file system (but it better be unmounted from the other system
if you want the command to succeed), or metaset -s <setname> -g
which gives the metaset away.  However, if you do this while the
cluster is active, I believe this will fail. Unfortunately, I've
seen cases where this kind of thing screws up the cluster
infrastructure.

Ben

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Darren Dunha » Fri, 28 Feb 2003 15:03:00




>> I am looking for Solaris9 volume manager vs Veritas volume manager
>> technical comparison document. Any inputs or document links are
>> welcome.
>> Solaris9 has ODS (open disk suite) Volume manager which comes free.
>> Why should pay for Veritas ??
> 1) IIRC, VxFS only works with VxVM

Nope, Both UFS and VxFS work fine with raw slices, VxVM volumes, and
ODS/LVM metadevices.

Quote:> 2) VxVM has the capability to decrease the size of a volume on the fly

You can attach or detach components from LVM also, correct?  This should
not have anything to do with UFS vs. VxFS, where only VxFS can be shrunk.

Quote:> 4) Layered volumes (1+0), though SDS does act like this when you have
>     0+1 with exactly the same size partitions of each slice.

Personally, I find that a feature of SDS/LVM.  I *love* using VxVM, but
layered volumes are too complex to look at.

There's this page...

http://www.eng.auburn.edu/pub/mail-lists/ssastuff/sdsvxvm.html

I don't agree with everything, but it's a good start.

My personal list of big differences is..

1) naming (I would never want to handle hundreds of SDS/LVM objects if
   they were all just numbered)
2) easy import/deport of disk groups
3) explicit handling of database in SDS/LVM vs automated handling in
   VxVM
4) 'vxassist'.  The ability to create a volume "top-down" instead of
   "bottom-up".  When I first used both, I always wanted the control of
   bottom-up creation.  Now that I understand what's happening and I
   trust it, the ability to let vxassist do more of the calculations for
   me is great.
5) DMP (multipathing) included with VxVM.  MPxIO is now available for
   Sun, but I believe it only works with sun storage products (not
   including the rebadged HP storage).  I've never used it to find out.

Also, I'm quite comforatble with what VxVM does when handling root
volumes, but for someone not as familiar, it can be a bit opaque if
something goes wrong there.  

--

Unix System Administrator                    Taos - The SysAdmin Company
Got some Dr Pepper?                           San Francisco, CA bay area
         < This line left intentionally blank to confuse you. >

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Darren Dunha » Fri, 28 Feb 2003 15:04:38



> Also... (not totally sure), but I believe only VxM can be used
> in a Sun Cluster (shared drive).  Which is interesting when you
> think about it.

I'm pretty sure that's not true now.  SDS/LVM is supported by the most
recent versions of Sun Cluster.

Veritas Cluster Server does not ship with any support for SDS/LVM at
all, but I've heard of some SDS agents that work with it are available
on the net.

--

Unix System Administrator                    Taos - The SysAdmin Company
Got some Dr Pepper?                           San Francisco, CA bay area
         < This line left intentionally blank to confuse you. >

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Robert Milkowsk » Fri, 28 Feb 2003 19:48:21




>> Also... (not totally sure), but I believe only VxM can be used
>> in a Sun Cluster (shared drive).  Which is interesting when you
>> think about it.

> I'm pretty sure that's not true now.  SDS/LVM is supported by the most
> recent versions of Sun Cluster.

Depends what you mean by "shared drive".
SDS/LVM dosn't allow you to access the same disks (metavolumes)
at the same time (for parallel databases, etc.) while VxVM
(with CVM feature enabled) does.

In other cases both are supported with SC3.0.

--
                                                Robert Milkowski

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Thomas Tornblo » Sun, 02 Mar 2003 08:04:10





> >> I am looking for Solaris9 volume manager vs Veritas volume manager
> >> technical comparison document. Any inputs or document links are
> >> welcome.
> >> Solaris9 has ODS (open disk suite) Volume manager which comes free.
> >> Why should pay for Veritas ??
> > 1) IIRC, VxFS only works with VxVM

Nope. VxFS works just as fine^H^H^H^H^H^H^H the same on DiskSuite or
on raw block devices.

It is vxfs and vxvm better integrated with vmsa/vxva, but that is just
for resizing.

Quote:

> > 2) VxVM has the capability to decrease the size of a volume on the fly
> > 3) The GUI is definitely more functional

The DS CLI is infinitely more useful/simple than the GUI:s on either
of the products or the vxvm CLI.

Quote:> > 4) Layered volumes (1+0), though SDS does act like this when you have
> >    0+1 with exactly the same size partitions of each slice.
> > 5) Familarity with VxVM vs SDS
> > To name a few.

> Also... (not totally sure), but I believe only VxM can be used
> in a Sun Cluster (shared drive).  Which is interesting when you
> think about it.

Not true.

Thomas

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by aryzh » Mon, 03 Mar 2003 21:56:45





> >> I am looking for Solaris9 volume manager vs Veritas volume manager
> >> technical comparison document. Any inputs or document links are
> >> welcome.
> >> Solaris9 has ODS (open disk suite) Volume manager which comes free.
> >> Why should pay for Veritas ??

> > 1) IIRC, VxFS only works with VxVM

> Nope, Both UFS and VxFS work fine with raw slices, VxVM volumes, and
> ODS/LVM metadevices.

> > 2) VxVM has the capability to decrease the size of a volume on the fly

> You can attach or detach components from LVM also, correct?  This should
> not have anything to do with UFS vs. VxFS, where only VxFS can be shrunk.

> > 4) Layered volumes (1+0), though SDS does act like this when you have
> >     0+1 with exactly the same size partitions of each slice.

> Personally, I find that a feature of SDS/LVM.  I *love* using VxVM, but
> layered volumes are too complex to look at.

> There's this page...

> http://www.eng.auburn.edu/pub/mail-lists/ssastuff/sdsvxvm.html

> I don't agree with everything, but it's a good start.

> My personal list of big differences is..

> 1) naming (I would never want to handle hundreds of SDS/LVM objects if
>    they were all just numbered)
> 2) easy import/deport of disk groups
> 3) explicit handling of database in SDS/LVM vs automated handling in
>    VxVM
> 4) 'vxassist'.  The ability to create a volume "top-down" instead of
>    "bottom-up".  When I first used both, I always wanted the control of
>    bottom-up creation.  Now that I understand what's happening and I
>    trust it, the ability to let vxassist do more of the calculations for
>    me is great.
> 5) DMP (multipathing) included with VxVM.  MPxIO is now available for
>    Sun, but I believe it only works with sun storage products (not
>    including the rebadged HP storage).  I've never used it to find out.

> Also, I'm quite comforatble with what VxVM does when handling root
> volumes, but for someone not as familiar, it can be a bit opaque if
> something goes wrong there.

My $0.02:

VxVM makes the physical disks self-identifying, so you can mov'em
around in the machine, and still have automatically recognised by
VxVM, no matter which controller/lun/target they are put on.

Growing/shrinking/rearranging the volumes is way more flexible with VxVM
than with Sun EVM.

Thus, scalability-wise VxVM is still stronger than Sun EVM

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Scott Howar » Mon, 03 Mar 2003 22:33:14



> My $0.02:

> VxVM makes the physical disks self-identifying, so you can mov'em
> around in the machine, and still have automatically recognised by
> VxVM, no matter which controller/lun/target they are put on.

As does SVM :

Device Relocation Information:
Device   Reloc  Device ID


This data is used to find disks after they are shuffled around in a system.

  Scott.

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Toi D » Fri, 14 Mar 2003 00:16:12


I'm not familiar with Solaris 9 Volume Manager but my guess is a fancy
name for DiskSuite.  If that is the case, here is a couple of
advantages:

1. VxVM allows you to easily export a diskgroup and import to another
system.  This is very helpful when you store data in an external
storage device such as a D1000.  You can connect that D1000 to another
system and in no time, you can assess your data.
2. In DiskSuite you still need to slice a disk with format.  So, the
max number of slices is 6 (save 1 for metadevice).  In VxVM, I don't
know of a limit on the number of volumes.  If there's one, it's much
higher than 6.

3. But on the other hand, DiskSuite is free (don't need to pay any
extra).  Depand on the environment, DiskSuite is still a good choice.

4. You can grow a file system with DiskSuite, too.  But srinking, you
would need VxFX (for both DiskSuite and VxVM).  With DiskSuite, you
would have to drop the whole slice.

5. If you have $$$, use VxVM

We use both DiskSuite and VxVM.



> > My $0.02:

> > VxVM makes the physical disks self-identifying, so you can mov'em
> > around in the machine, and still have automatically recognised by
> > VxVM, no matter which controller/lun/target they are put on.

> As does SVM :

> Device Relocation Information:
> Device   Reloc  Device ID


> This data is used to find disks after they are shuffled around in a system.

>   Scott.

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Tony Walto » Fri, 14 Mar 2003 00:37:12



> I'm not familiar with Solaris 9 Volume Manager but my guess is a fancy
> name for DiskSuite.

Pretty close. The essential difference between SDS and SVM (Solaris
Volume Manager) is that from Solaris 9 it's included with the OS as
installed from the CD. This means, for example, that the CDROM OS
understands SVM so you can upgrade a mirrored configuration direct
without having to go through the hoops of breaking root mirrors,
upgrading submissors then bolting it all together again afterwards.

SVM is part of the "End User" or larger install cluster.

--
Tony

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Ben Taylo » Sun, 16 Mar 2003 09:05:44



> I'm not familiar with Solaris 9 Volume Manager but my guess is a fancy
> name for DiskSuite.  If that is the case, here is a couple of
> advantages:

> 1. VxVM allows you to easily export a diskgroup and import to another
> system.  This is very helpful when you store data in an external
> storage device such as a D1000.  You can connect that D1000 to another
> system and in no time, you can assess your data.

You can do the same with DiskSuite if you use a metaset instead
of a metadevice.  The creation is basically the same but you use
the "-s <metaset name>" in the creation.  You use metaset -t or
metaset -g to take or give control of the metaset.  Obviously,
you have to unmount the Disksuite file systems before trying
this though.

Quote:> 2. In DiskSuite you still need to slice a disk with format.  So, the
> max number of slices is 6 (save 1 for metadevice).  In VxVM, I don't
> know of a limit on the number of volumes.  If there's one, it's much
> higher than 6.

In addition, DiskSuite 4.2.1 added the concept of a soft
partition.  Instead of slicing up a disk, now you can create
a big raid 0, raid 1 or raid 1+0, and then slice soft partitions
out of the raid device.  This really makes maintenance and
such much easier, or if you haven't got a use for all the
disk space at the time of creation.

HTH,

Ben

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Thomas H Jones » Fri, 21 Mar 2003 01:12:31




>I'm not familiar with Solaris 9 Volume Manager but my guess is a fancy
>name for DiskSuite.  If that is the case, here is a couple of
>advantages:

Heh... probably shouldn't make statements like the below without knowing
both products.

Quote:>1. VxVM allows you to easily export a diskgroup and import to another
>system.  This is very helpful when you store data in an external
>storage device such as a D1000.  You can connect that D1000 to another
>system and in no time, you can assess your data.

Starting with SDS 2.4.1 and carried into SVM, you have 'metasets'. These
are roughly analagous to Veritas's 'diskgroups'.

Quote:>2. In DiskSuite you still need to slice a disk with format.  So, the
>max number of slices is 6 (save 1 for metadevice).  In VxVM, I don't
>know of a limit on the number of volumes.  If there's one, it's much
>higher than 6.

SDS 2.4.1 and SVM both offer 'soft partitions'. These are roughly
analagous to Veritas's 'subdisks'.

Quote:>3. But on the other hand, DiskSuite is free (don't need to pay any
>extra).  Depand on the environment, DiskSuite is still a good choice.

Though, to get SVM, you have to pay the per-CPU licensing fees that
Solaris 9 introduced.

Quote:>5. If you have $$$, use VxVM

If you are doing clustering, either SunCluster or Veritas, VxVM tends
to be a better choice. SDS/SVM is fairly bletcherous in a cluster
context.

-tom
--

"You can only be -so- accurate with a claw-hammer."  --me

 
 
 

Solaris9 Volume Manager Vs Veritas Volume Manager

Post by Dragan Cvetkovi » Fri, 21 Mar 2003 04:46:54



Quote:

> If you are doing clustering, either SunCluster or Veritas, VxVM tends
> to be a better choice. SDS/SVM is fairly bletcherous in a cluster
> context.

Don't know what bletcherous mean, but I find the SVM easier to use with Sun
Cluster 3.0 since you don't have to register it with the cluster.

Bye, Dragan

--
Dragan Cvetkovic,

To be or not to be is true. G. Boole      No it isn't.  L. E. J. Brouwer

 
 
 

1. Veritas Volume Manager vs Sun Volume Manager

I'm about to build a number of systems connected to a SAN. I intend to
have two internal disks on Sun SPARC servers, and the rest of the disks
from a SAN.

I have not used Veritas Volume Manager before but have used Sun Volume
Manager but on smaller system. Total disk storage per server will be
about 1-3Tb. I don't have info on LUN sizes at the moment.

Question is - is there any major advantage to using Veritas Volume
Manager in this configuration over Sun Volume Manager? Is it worth the
extra money?

My thought is: mirror the internal disks for the OS. Request 100Gb
(first number that came into my head) LUNs from an array on the SAN and
use SVM to concatenate these into the correct size i.e. 10 disk for 1Tb,
20 for 2Tb etc. Since the disks on the SAN will be configured as RAID-5
or RAID-50, further RAID should be unnecessary???

So - will SVM do the job or should I look at VxVM an why?

Andy

2. Where I can download ip_masq_h323 from for Kernel 2.2.19?

3. Difference between veritas volume manager and Sun StorEdge volume manager?

4. Tseng 4000/Sony Trinitron CPD-1303

5. Sun Volume Manager/Veritas Volume Manager

6. libresolv question...

7. (Issue) Upgrade from Sun Enterprise Volume Manager to Veritas Volume Manager

8. pppd client to Attachmate RLN server

9. Solaris 9 volume manager OR Veritas volume manager ?

10. (Issue) Upgrade from Sun Enterprise Volume Manager to Veritas Volume Manager

11. Mounting Volume Manager File Systems without the Volume Manager software

12. Growing a RAID-5 volume with Veritas Volume Manager