grub and lilo booting problems

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Corné Lombar » Thu, 10 Jan 2002 12:18:44



I  installed both grub and lilo into my mbr on different instsallation
trials. Grub came up at boot time with

Grub

and lilo did

LI

.

I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to boot.
That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume that you
can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !  I can not
boot from floppy either.

I read on some webpages that you should always check the lba32 option on the
installation, but on the install page it says that that option should rarely
be used.

What about parameters ?  I have an entry into the parameters (i did not type
it in) line on the screen where you pick the boot loader to install....

Again, no way that i can get to lilo.conf or grub.conf

Thanks for the suggestions so far
Corne

 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Raj » Thu, 10 Jan 2002 12:24:23


Check the geometry of the hard disk that your linux installation reports
when you're installing - make sure the bios settings are the same.
 Thats the only time I have experienced this problem.  Its almost always
a problem with the bios.. Also try enabling block mode, or lba32 or
whatever block option your bios has, that should make the system boot
right up.  If you get the bios settings right, it'll just boot right up,
you won't need to reinstall.  
Good luck!


>I  installed both grub and lilo into my mbr on different instsallation
>trials. Grub came up at boot time with

>Grub

>and lilo did

>LI

>.

>I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to boot.
>That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume that you
>can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !  I can not
>boot from floppy either.

>I read on some webpages that you should always check the lba32 option on the
>installation, but on the install page it says that that option should rarely
>be used.

>What about parameters ?  I have an entry into the parameters (i did not type
>it in) line on the screen where you pick the boot loader to install....

>Again, no way that i can get to lilo.conf or grub.conf

>Thanks for the suggestions so far
>Corne

--
----------------------------
"The world owes you nothing.
It was here first."
                - Mark Twain

 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Corné Lombar » Fri, 11 Jan 2002 00:15:27


Raj,

Can you give my a bit more detail on how to check the geometry ?
I find that linux modifies my partition tables on win98 disk installation
because the next time i try to boot win98, i first have to fix the partition
tables in order to boot win98.  Luckily i have norton rescue disks to do
this easily.

I will try the installation with the lba32 option turned on.

Thanks
Corne.


> Check the geometry of the hard disk that your linux installation reports
> when you're installing - make sure the bios settings are the same.
>  Thats the only time I have experienced this problem.  Its almost always
> a problem with the bios.. Also try enabling block mode, or lba32 or
> whatever block option your bios has, that should make the system boot
> right up.  If you get the bios settings right, it'll just boot right up,
> you won't need to reinstall.
> Good luck!


> >I  installed both grub and lilo into my mbr on different instsallation
> >trials. Grub came up at boot time with

> >Grub

> >and lilo did

> >LI

> >.

> >I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to
boot.
> >That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume that
you
> >can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !  I can
not
> >boot from floppy either.

> >I read on some webpages that you should always check the lba32 option on
the
> >installation, but on the install page it says that that option should
rarely
> >be used.

> >What about parameters ?  I have an entry into the parameters (i did not
type
> >it in) line on the screen where you pick the boot loader to install....

> >Again, no way that i can get to lilo.conf or grub.conf

> >Thanks for the suggestions so far
> >Corne

> --
> ----------------------------
> "The world owes you nothing.
> It was here first."
>                 - Mark Twain

 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Raj » Fri, 11 Jan 2002 00:33:18


I'm not too sure about this, but usually there should be a message on
boot up when you start the linux installation.  Here is a listing of my
log (found in /var/log/dmesg) that gives the geometry:
hda: 12706470 sectors (6506 MB) w/128KiB Cache, CHS=13446/15/63
hdd: 2116800 sectors (1084 MB) w/128KiB Cache, CHS=2100/16/63

This has to match with whats there in the bios settings.  
One way that I can think of of getting this information is to load in
the linux startup disk, type 'expert' in the boot: options and keep
going till you get to the command promt.  Then type in sfdisk /dev/hda
--show-geometry .  That will tell you what the kernal thinks your hard
disk is.  See if there is a difference between this report and what you
have in your bios.  
hope that helps!
cheers!


>Raj,

>Can you give my a bit more detail on how to check the geometry ?
>I find that linux modifies my partition tables on win98 disk installation
>because the next time i try to boot win98, i first have to fix the partition
>tables in order to boot win98.  Luckily i have norton rescue disks to do
>this easily.

>I will try the installation with the lba32 option turned on.

>Thanks
>Corne.



>>Check the geometry of the hard disk that your linux installation reports
>>when you're installing - make sure the bios settings are the same.
>> Thats the only time I have experienced this problem.  Its almost always
>>a problem with the bios.. Also try enabling block mode, or lba32 or
>>whatever block option your bios has, that should make the system boot
>>right up.  If you get the bios settings right, it'll just boot right up,
>>you won't need to reinstall.
>>Good luck!


>>>I  installed both grub and lilo into my mbr on different instsallation
>>>trials. Grub came up at boot time with

>>>Grub

>>>and lilo did

>>>LI

>>>.

>>>I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to

>boot.

>>>That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume that

>you

>>>can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !  I can

>not

>>>boot from floppy either.

>>>I read on some webpages that you should always check the lba32 option on

>the

>>>installation, but on the install page it says that that option should

>rarely

>>>be used.

>>>What about parameters ?  I have an entry into the parameters (i did not

>type

>>>it in) line on the screen where you pick the boot loader to install....

>>>Again, no way that i can get to lilo.conf or grub.conf

>>>Thanks for the suggestions so far
>>>Corne

>>--
>>----------------------------
>>"The world owes you nothing.
>>It was here first."
>>                - Mark Twain

--
----------------------------
"The world owes you nothing.
It was here first."
                - Mark Twain
 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Corné Lombar » Fri, 11 Jan 2002 03:29:21


Ok, i found a small geometry mismatch between bios (reported by powerquest partitioninfo) and linux (booting process screens).

bios :
win98 disk     2487/ 240 / 63
linux disk      7298/ 255 / 63

linux booting process :

win98 disk (+- 18 g)    2487 / 240/ 63
linux disk   ( +- 60 gig)  7299 / 255 / 63

so, a difference of 1 cylinder on linux disk.

so, my next question, while i am researching how to fix this, is how do i fix this ?  Who is wrong and who is right ?

Corne.


  I'm not too sure about this, but usually there should be a message on boot up when you start the linux installation.  Here is a listing of my log (found in /var/log/dmesg) that gives the geometry:
  hda: 12706470 sectors (6506 MB) w/128KiB Cache, CHS=13446/15/63
  hdd: 2116800 sectors (1084 MB) w/128KiB Cache, CHS=2100/16/63

  This has to match with whats there in the bios settings.  
  One way that I can think of of getting this information is to load in the linux startup disk, type 'expert' in the boot: options and keep going till you get to the command promt.  Then type in sfdisk /dev/hda --show-geometry .  That will tell you what the kernal thinks your hard disk is.  See if there is a difference between this report and what you have in your bios.  
  hope that helps!
  cheers!




I  installed both grub and lilo into my mbr on different instsallationtrials. Grub came up at boot time withGruband lilo didLI.I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to
boot.
That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume that
you
can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !  I can
not
boot from floppy either.I read on some webpages that you should always check the lba32 option on
the
installation, but on the install page it says that that option should
rarely
be used.What about parameters ?  I have an entry into the parameters (i did not
type
it in) line on the screen where you pick the boot loader to install....Again, no way that i can get to lilo.conf or grub.confThanks for the suggestions so farCorne
------------------------------"The world owes you nothing.It was here first."                - Mark Twain

--
----------------------------
"The world owes you nothing.
It was here first."
                - Mark Twain

 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Raj » Fri, 11 Jan 2002 04:01:23


assume linux is right (for the moment)  Since you have only linux on
that disk, its not likely to cause much loss.  Change the settings in
bios and try it out.  
I'm not sure about who's right and who's wrong - but if you look at the
way most ide drives are setup these days, the figures really don't mean
much.  The internal drive geometry long since stopped having a
correlation with the external or visible geometry.  Can you imagine 255
heads stacked up?  Internally the drive will have 5 heads, translated
externally so something else.  But I digress.. change the settings in
your bios and see if you system will boot up into linux.  If the bios is
set to 'autodetect' change it to 'user setting' and feed in the values
reported by linux manually.  Hopefully you won't even have to reinstall
linux!
cheers


> Ok, i found a small geometry mismatch between bios (reported
> by powerquest partitioninfo) and linux (booting process screens).

> bios :

> win98 disk     2487/ 240 / 63

> linux disk      7298/ 255 / 63

> linux booting process :

> win98 disk (+- 18 g)    2487 / 240/ 63

> linux disk   ( +- 60 gig)  7299 / 255 / 63

> so, a difference of 1 cylinder on linux disk.

> so, my next question, while i am researching how to fix this, is how
> do i fix this ?  Who is wrong and who is right ?

> Corne.




>     I'm not too sure about this, but usually there should be a message
>     on boot up when you start the linux installation.  Here is a
>     listing of my log (found in /var/log/dmesg) that gives the geometry:
>     hda: 12706470 sectors (6506 MB) w/128KiB Cache, CHS=13446/15/63
>     hdd: 2116800 sectors (1084 MB) w/128KiB Cache, CHS=2100/16/63

>     This has to match with whats there in the bios settings.  
>     One way that I can think of of getting this information is to load
>     in the linux startup disk, type 'expert' in the boot: options and
>     keep going till you get to the command promt.  Then type in sfdisk
>     /dev/hda --show-geometry .  That will tell you what the kernal
>     thinks your hard disk is.  See if there is a difference between
>     this report and what you have in your bios.  
>     hope that helps!
>     cheers!


>>Raj,

>>Can you give my a bit more detail on how to check the geometry ?
>>I find that linux modifies my partition tables on win98 disk installation
>>because the next time i try to boot win98, i first have to fix the partition
>>tables in order to boot win98.  Luckily i have norton rescue disks to do
>>this easily.

>>I will try the installation with the lba32 option turned on.

>>Thanks
>>Corne.



>>>Check the geometry of the hard disk that your linux installation reports
>>>when you're installing - make sure the bios settings are the same.
>>> Thats the only time I have experienced this problem.  Its almost always
>>>a problem with the bios.. Also try enabling block mode, or lba32 or
>>>whatever block option your bios has, that should make the system boot
>>>right up.  If you get the bios settings right, it'll just boot right up,
>>>you won't need to reinstall.
>>>Good luck!


>>>>I  installed both grub and lilo into my mbr on different instsallation
>>>>trials. Grub came up at boot time with

>>>>Grub

>>>>and lilo did

>>>>LI

>>>>.

>>>>I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to

>>boot.

>>>>That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume that

>>you

>>>>can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !  I can

>>not

>>>>boot from floppy either.

>>>>I read on some webpages that you should always check the lba32 option on

>>the

>>>>installation, but on the install page it says that that option should

>>rarely

>>>>be used.

>>>>What about parameters ?  I have an entry into the parameters (i did not

>>type

>>>>it in) line on the screen where you pick the boot loader to install....

>>>>Again, no way that i can get to lilo.conf or grub.conf

>>>>Thanks for the suggestions so far
>>>>Corne

>>>--
>>>----------------------------
>>>"The world owes you nothing.
>>>It was here first."
>>>                - Mark Twain

>--
>----------------------------
>"The world owes you nothing.
>It was here first."
>                - Mark Twain

--
----------------------------
"The world owes you nothing.
It was here first."
                - Mark Twain
 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Timothy Murp » Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:27:07



>I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to boot.
>That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume that you
>can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !  I can not
>boot from floppy either.

You could try the tomsrtbt floppy.
(Find it by google.)
This will allow you to mount your disks,
modify lilo.conf and re-run lilo.

--
Timothy Murphy  

tel: 086-233 6090
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland

 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Lawrence K. Murph » Fri, 11 Jan 2002 11:17:17





>>I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to
>>boot. That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume
>>that you can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !
>> I can not boot from floppy either.

> You could try the tomsrtbt floppy.
> (Find it by google.)
> This will allow you to mount your disks, modify lilo.conf and re-run
> lilo.

 Hi,
You said you fixed the windows problem with Norton. Did Norton's ask you
if you wanted it to fix the boot record? If it did and you said yes, it
erased your Linux boot record. That's how I got Lilo off my computer when
I installed a version of Linux I didn't want.
Larry
 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Anupc » Fri, 11 Jan 2002 15:47:09


Hey you need to somehow boot to linux the. The only option now is get to boot
from CD if this too is not possible. Try downloading Loadlin and the vmlinuz
image file to the dos system then try booting with loadlin I guess u will have
to give the parameter root=/dev/hdb or /hdc or /hdd since this problem wouldn't
have been caused with root=/dev/hda .
 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Corné Lombar » Sat, 12 Jan 2002 01:02:53


Thanks for the tip.  If grub or lilo failed to boot my pc, then i have to
use my norton disk to fix partition tables,boot record in order for win98 to
boot again and to get rid of the new mbr that doesn't work.  So, yes, i am
aware of it, but i only do that after grub / lilo failed to boot my pc.

Looks like i am having more luck with GRUB since i can see all 4 letters on
the screen, just no options.  I have not found a lot of info on the possible
problems i might have (knowing that i have a geometry mismatch, yes).  Maybe
GRUB is coping with the difference and has a different problem.  I found a
lot of websites with lilo problems (very few solutions, though) but not much
grub problems.  any suggestions for grub boot problems...... websites you
have found helpful......

I have a compaq pc and i am battling with a geometry mismatch at the moment.
Compaq conveniently left off the option to modify the geometry of any disk
in their bios program.  They have some compaq setup utility you get into at
boot time, which only lets you view info, i couldn't even get to the
geometry info in the tool.  Basically a useless tool unless you want to
change the boot order of the disks......  When i asked compaq for a bios
upgrade, they had me upgrade the ROM software which supposedly supports the
bigger disks ( i have 60 gig disk).  Basically this did not solve my
problem.

I am willing to try a few more installs, else i might have to give up and
try again in 5 years time......






> >>I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux to
> >>boot. That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions assume
> >>that you can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the problems !
> >> I can not boot from floppy either.

> > You could try the tomsrtbt floppy.
> > (Find it by google.)
> > This will allow you to mount your disks, modify lilo.conf and re-run
> > lilo.

>  Hi,
> You said you fixed the windows problem with Norton. Did Norton's ask you
> if you wanted it to fix the boot record? If it did and you said yes, it
> erased your Linux boot record. That's how I got Lilo off my computer when
> I installed a version of Linux I didn't want.
> Larry

 
 
 

grub and lilo booting problems

Post by Lawrence K. Murph » Sat, 12 Jan 2002 09:56:51




> Thanks for the tip.  If grub or lilo failed to boot my pc, then i have
> to use my norton disk to fix partition tables,boot record in order for
> win98 to boot again and to get rid of the new mbr that doesn't work.
> So, yes, i am aware of it, but i only do that after grub / lilo failed
> to boot my pc.

> Looks like i am having more luck with GRUB since i can see all 4 letters
> on the screen, just no options.  I have not found a lot of info on the
> possible problems i might have (knowing that i have a geometry mismatch,
> yes).  Maybe GRUB is coping with the difference and has a different
> problem.  I found a lot of websites with lilo problems (very few
> solutions, though) but not much grub problems.  any suggestions for grub
> boot problems...... websites you have found helpful......

> I have a compaq pc and i am battling with a geometry mismatch at the
> moment. Compaq conveniently left off the option to modify the geometry
> of any disk in their bios program.  They have some compaq setup utility
> you get into at boot time, which only lets you view info, i couldn't
> even get to the geometry info in the tool.  Basically a useless tool
> unless you want to change the boot order of the disks......  When i
> asked compaq for a bios upgrade, they had me upgrade the ROM software
> which supposedly supports the bigger disks ( i have 60 gig disk).
> Basically this did not solve my problem.

> I am willing to try a few more installs, else i might have to give up
> and try again in 5 years time......






>> >>I can not run any linux commands.... i am still trying to get linux
>> >>to boot. That is the frustrating part of it.  All possible solutions
>> >>assume that you can boot into linux.... but the boot loaders are the
>> >>problems !
>> >> I can not boot from floppy either.

>> > You could try the tomsrtbt floppy.
>> > (Find it by google.)
>> > This will allow you to mount your disks, modify lilo.conf and re-run
>> > lilo.

>>  Hi,
>> You said you fixed the windows problem with Norton. Did Norton's ask
>> you if you wanted it to fix the boot record? If it did and you said
>> yes, it erased your Linux boot record. That's how I got Lilo off my
>> computer when I installed a version of Linux I didn't want. Larry

Hi again,
I found the same thing you did, lots of problems - few solutions. I am
very new to Linux, but I have been reading newsgroups and books for about
a year now. I have seen so many boot problems I installed seperated hard
drives with a hard drive switch so they are totally isolated. I too have
a sixty gig drive on Linux and 30 on windows ME. My first computer was an
E-machine and they didn't give much help with the bios either. If I
didn't enjoy computers so much I would have given up long ago. Hardware
is one of the biggest reasons for problems from the stand point of Linux
people developing drivers and software for the less knowledgable users
like myself. I've learned alot but have a long way to go. One thing I
have seen is persistance pays off. Someone will have the solution if you
don't find it yourself first. I would like to be of more than supporting
help, butI believe in helping any way possible. I was ready to throw
Linux out the window all together, but my stubbornness wooudn't let me.
It really is a good system and I'm determined to learn it. I installed or
tried to install 7 versions of Linux at least twice, Red Hat and Mandrake
6 times each before getting a working system. Hope you do better. Sorry
I'm not really of any useful help.
Larry
 
 
 

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