ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by Ryan 'Gozar' Colli » Fri, 29 Jan 1993 02:20:16



        Well, I just received the recent Micro Center ad, and form the
looks of the prices, I really don't see anyone buying a Falcon other then
musicians.

        First, we have the Macs..... Hmmmmmm, a LC II with 4 megs of ram
and 80 meg hard drive... $1190 (All prices I'm going to quote are without
monitor, just to keep it in line with the Falcon without monitor) IIsi,
same config, $1500.

        Oh, you don't like Macs. How about an Intel based machine.
MicroCenter doesn't even carry any 386 machines. (Except for notebooks.) A
Compaq Prolinea, with a 486sx, 120 meg hard drive, SVGA, and 4 megs of ram.
(Also a fax/modem) $1398! (Also included is one-year on-site support!!)

        As much as I would like the Falcon to succeed, I don't see it
having any sort of success anywhere but the musical world, and then only
until a DSP card comes out for the Mac or Intel world. (And people use the
argument that since they weren't built in, software won't support them. Is
that why Miami here just bought 12 macs for use with Midi? Once a DSP card
is released, support will follow)

(I'm not associated with Micro Center at all, and I'm not trying to be an
adverti*t, I just wanted people to see prices other than mail-order.)

Later.......

------======={{{{{{{{((((((Ryan 'Gozar' Collins))))))))}}}}}}}}=======--------



                                                  \  R.COLLINS1 on GEnie
            ------======={{{{{{{{(((((())))))))}}}}}}}}=======-----  27-JAN-1993

 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by dlk0m.. » Sat, 30 Jan 1993 01:57:10



Quote:>    Well, I just received the recent Micro Center ad, and form the
> looks of the prices, I really don't see anyone buying a Falcon other then
> musicians.

>    First, we have the Macs..... Hmmmmmm, a LC II with 4 megs of ram
> and 80 meg hard drive... $1190 (All prices I'm going to quote are without
> monitor, just to keep it in line with the Falcon without monitor) IIsi,
> same config, $1500.

>    Oh, you don't like Macs. How about an Intel based machine.
> MicroCenter doesn't even carry any 386 machines. (Except for notebooks.) A
> Compaq Prolinea, with a 486sx, 120 meg hard drive, SVGA, and 4 megs of ram.
> (Also a fax/modem) $1398! (Also included is one-year on-site support!!)

>    As much as I would like the Falcon to succeed, I don't see it
> having any sort of success anywhere but the musical world, and then only
> until a DSP card comes out for the Mac or Intel world. (And people use the
> argument that since they weren't built in, software won't support them. Is
> that why Miami here just bought 12 macs for use with Midi? Once a DSP card
> is released, support will follow)

> (I'm not associated with Micro Center at all, and I'm not trying to be an
> adverti*t, I just wanted people to see prices other than mail-order.)

> Later.......

> ------======={{{{{{{{((((((Ryan 'Gozar' Collins))))))))}}}}}}}}=======--------

  While I agree that Atari is in very ruff shape I would like to point out that
the prices you mention are after serious discounting.  Sure, I Falcon 4/65
retails for $1295, but after discounting, I expect it around $1000.  Let's be
practical for a minute.  After the Die Hards get their hands on them and the
machine begin to rest in quantity, the price will drop.  How much can you get a
1 meg STe for (ans $379).  It retails at $599!  That is one hell of a drop.  I
expect the same will happen to the Falcon.

  Will I buy one?  I think so, bt in the two piece case.  It will be the 030
configuration at 33Mhz I suppose.  I know I won't be able to afford the 040.
And it will suit me just fine.  ANd if I can get Mac II or 486 emmulation off
it, hey that's even better.  For the record, I own no emmulator for my Mega ST
and have never really seen the use for it.  All my software does everything I
need it to, and more.  I doubt I will ever use Calamus SL to its fullest
potential, but that's cool.

  So cool.  Computers aren't the end all/be all that they want to be.  All the
technology filtering down to us home users is already out of date.  So use what
you can and enjoy it for what it is.  That's why you bought the thing in the
first place...

I have no further communications.
Mark Santora

 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by ted croft bro » Sat, 30 Jan 1993 08:06:24



>Btw, I have heard here on the net that a next generation Mac will have a
>built in DSP later this year.  Will Apple build a plug in DSP card for older
>Macs that will be compatible with the built in one?  If they don't will
>software be written to use it or is it for use by the system only
>(QuickDraw GX ???).

Yes Apple is expected to realease DSP Macs this summer.  Here's the blurb
from Murph's Vaporware Column:

**************
 Apple's first two multimedia
workstations (codenamed Cyclone--see last July's column) will debut in
June.  These Macs will have two sets of digital signal processor (DSP)
chips and Fast and Wide SCSI.  Prices of $2,500 and $5,500 are expected.
At least 25 developers are already writing software to take advantage of
the DSP chips jointly developed by Storm Technology and SuperMac
Technology.  An even more powerful "media server" is expected in the
fall.
*********************

With Storm Technology involved you can bet that you won't have to wait
for jpeg decompression to be in the hardware.  I don't know for sure, but
I would guess that Apple (or some third party) will release a DSP card for
the older Macs.  Considering the Mac architecture, I don't really see a
problem for a card to gain the same level OS support as built in hardware.
And once that is done, all programs looking to see if it is present will
find it and use it.  (A similar thing happens with Quicktime right now.)
This means that once you add the card it can have immediate effects on other
programs (like Photoshop and any Quicktime program).  Since Photoshop is
one of the biggest users of DSP add-on boards on the mac, I really see that
being available at release time.

Of course, we still have *no* idea at how good the sound will be, and what
level of video it supports.  At least one of the machines is supposed to be
an 040.  Of course the Falcon is still cheaper, and it should have at least
a 3 month head start (assuming release for Falcon in March).  I've just
developed a "wait and see" attitude.

--


 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by Glen Sesci » Sat, 30 Jan 1993 06:11:19



Quote:>(And people use the
>argument that since they weren't built in, software won't support them. Is
>that why Miami here just bought 12 macs for use with Midi? Once a DSP card
>is released, support will follow)

        Well there are plenty of DSP boards for both the Mac and the PC right
now.  Where is the software support?  Right now you have to use the software
from the company who makes the board.  Until a defacto standard board evolves
(ala Sound Blaster) for DSP you won't see the software support.  The point is
that ANY Falcon software that would benifit from the DSP can use it.

Btw, I have heard here on the net that a next generation Mac will have a
built in DSP later this year.  Will Apple build a plug in DSP card for older
Macs that will be compatible with the built in one?  If they don't will
software be written to use it or is it for use by the system only
(QuickDraw GX ???).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Now You're Playing With Power Without The Price!"  Glen Sescila   |||
                                                                  / | \
My opinions do not necessarily reflect those of my employer and probably are

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by GIGGEY Mike » Sun, 31 Jan 1993 06:53:15


Everyone seems to be forgetting the other component in a computer system.
Software!!!  Software on both the PC and the Mac is considerably more
expensive.
 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by Ryan 'Gozar' Colli » Sun, 31 Jan 1993 12:02:50



Quote:> Everyone seems to be forgetting the other component in a computer system.
> Software!!!  Software on both the PC and the Mac is considerably more
> expensive.

        I thought this at first to, until I started looking for software. I
use Microsoft Works, which retails for $149. Now its a little more
expensive than say, Wordflair II ($119) but it is a lot more useful. I can
save my document onto a disk, walk to the computer lab, and print it out
with no problem whatsoever. (If Wordlfair II could save in some sort of
standard format, like Word, Wordperfect, or Works, I would've bought it in
an instant!)

Later.......

------======={{{{{{{{((((((Ryan 'Gozar' Collins))))))))}}}}}}}}=======--------



                                                  \  R.COLLINS1 on GEnie
            ------======={{{{{{{{(((((())))))))}}}}}}}}=======-----  29-JAN-1993

 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by 01mbmcc.. » Mon, 01 Feb 1993 04:49:37


Quote:>> Everyone seems to be forgetting the other component in a computer system.
>> Software!!!  Software on both the PC and the Mac is considerably more
>> expensive.

>    I thought this at first to, until I started looking for software. I
> use Microsoft Works, which retails for $149. Now its a little more
> expensive than say, Wordflair II ($119) but it is a lot more useful. I can
> save my document onto a disk, walk to the computer lab, and print it out
> with no problem whatsoever. (If Wordlfair II could save in some sort of
> standard format, like Word, Wordperfect, or Works, I would've bought it in
> an instant!)

If WordFlair doesn't save in ASCII format, then it stinks.  WordPerfect can
easily import ASCII files -- I do all my papers this way.

                                -Matt

 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by Secret M » Tue, 02 Feb 1993 03:18:56



Quote:>Everyone seems to be forgetting the other component in a computer system.
>Software!!!  Software on both the PC and the Mac is considerably more
>expensive.

Yup, it is a lot cheaper to pick up ST software from the clearance bin.
 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by davi.. » Wed, 03 Feb 1993 02:39:31



>If WordFlair doesn't save in ASCII format, then it stinks.  WordPerfect can
>easily import ASCII files -- I do all my papers this way.

Before any rumors start spreading, WordFlair *will* save a file in ASCII
format.  In fact, the original installation manual gave instructions on
modifying the GDOS ASSIGN.SYS file, which is an ASCII text file.

-- David Paschall-Zimbel

 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by Ryan 'Gozar' Colli » Wed, 03 Feb 1993 03:46:09



>>> Everyone seems to be forgetting the other component in a computer system.
>>> Software!!!  Software on both the PC and the Mac is considerably more
>>> expensive.

>>        I thought this at first to, until I started looking for software. I
>> use Microsoft Works, which retails for $149. Now its a little more
>> expensive than say, Wordflair II ($119) but it is a lot more useful. I can
>> save my document onto a disk, walk to the computer lab, and print it out
>> with no problem whatsoever. (If Wordlfair II could save in some sort of
>> standard format, like Word, Wordperfect, or Works, I would've bought it in
>> an instant!)

> If WordFlair doesn't save in ASCII format, then it stinks.  WordPerfect can
> easily import ASCII files -- I do all my papers this way.

        But I don't want to go to ASCII, then I lose all my formatting, and
have to spend another 30 minutes in the lab reformatting my document.

Later.......

------======={{{{{{{{((((((Ryan 'Gozar' Collins))))))))}}}}}}}}=======--------



                                                  \  R.COLLINS1 on GEnie
            ------======={{{{{{{{(((((())))))))}}}}}}}}=======-----   1-FEB-1993

 
 
 

ADVOCACY: Prices, Prices, and more Prices.....

Post by Gordon James Farre » Wed, 03 Feb 1993 07:55:40



>If WordFlair doesn't save in ASCII format, then it stinks.  WordPerfect can
>easily import ASCII files -- I do all my papers this way.

Fear not.  Wordflair II (and, I presume, Wordflair I) does save and read
ASCII.

Quote:

>                            -Matt

--
________________________________________________________________________________


Simon Fraser University |                          | don't fall off."
 
 
 

1. ADVOCACY: More prices, prices, prices

        Well, I just thought I would post some more prices. (I have the
flyer in my hands now instead of going from memory)

        These are from Cincinnati's Micro Center Store. (I won't post a
number, I don't want this to be to big of a advertisement :-)  Everything
doesn't include a monitor, unless specified)

Macintosh prices:

        Mac LC II 4/80  $1079 (with keyboard)
        Mac IIsi 5/80   $1449 (without Keyboard)

Intel Based: (MicroCenter didn't even advertise any 386 based systems
                (except notebook computers))

        Entry Level System:
                486sx, 1 meg, 40 meg hd, gray-scale monitor, dos 5 (oohh!)
                        $799

        Complete System:
                486sx, 2megs, 100 meg hd, vga monitor, Windows (ooohh!)
                        $999

        486dx system:
                486dx, 4 megs, 100 meg hd, svga monitor, Windows, mouse
                        $1499

        Accelerated Windows System:
                486sx, 4 megs, 100 meg hd, svga monitor, accelerated
                graphics card
                        $1399
                (for $200 more you can get this with a 486dx2 at 50Mhz)

I don't see with these prices that any company can ever successfully
release a "non-standard" computer and have it succeed. Unless... it was
backed by solid support and offered better value for the money.

(I just wanted to post solid numbers from something other than mail-order
places)

Later.......

------======={{{{{{{{((((((Ryan 'Gozar' Collins))))))))}}}}}}}}=======--------



                                                  \  R.COLLINS1 on GEnie
            ------======={{{{{{{{(((((())))))))}}}}}}}}=======-----  27-JAN-1993

2. 16550, PS/2 m55sx and OS/2 6.167f?

3. ADVOCACY: New Macs out - Falcon price obsolete?

4. Win2000 won't see over 8gb on 2nd drive

5. ADVOCACY: RE: 386SX prices

6. Tools that support HOOD

7. ADVOCACY: Re: 386SX prices

8. The Case Against Using the Microsoft .NET Framework in the MySQL Win32 Port

9. ADVOCACY: RE: 386SX prices

10. eBay auction over: WAS THE FINAL PRICE TOO LOW?

11. Price list

12. eBay auction - Page 6 issue 2 - price reduced

13. 8 bit atari wil pay fair price